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#569282 - 09/27/17 07:09 PM I voted with my wallet.......  
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GoFirstClass Offline
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Grand Poobah

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Pasco, WA
At the beginning of the Seahawks/Titans game last Sunday both teams elected to remain in the locker rooms until after the singing of the National Anthem.

I didn't realize it until I had switched over from the other game I was watching, and my wife read a short blurb about it and read Pete Carroll's statement.

I feel every player and coach has a right to speak out and/or protest about whatever the cause du jour is. When they choose to do that protest by not being present for the National Anthem that pi$$es me off. They are causing an affront to our country, the very country that affords them the opportunity to make millions of dollars a year, and the country that I spent 7.5 years defending during the Vietnam war era. .

So, I voted with my wallet. I turned off the damned TV, took down the "12" flag I have flown for every game and went to Costco. Fugem. My small protest may go unnoticed by the NFL, but if enough people who are offended put their principles ahead of their enjoyment of watching a bunch of spoiled millionaires play their sport, maybe the NFL and others will take notice.

Attendance across the NFL is down this year. http://www.businessinsider.com/nfl-a...ce-down-2017-9 Maybe the NFL is going to realize that people vote with their wallets. We are already tired of paying $50 for parking, $150 for a seat, $15 for a beer and $15 for a hot dog.

Now please notice that I did not address what Trump tweeted about this. I don't care about his opinion. I also didn't comment about what Goodell and the team owners said in response to Trump. I don't care.

Please don't turn this into a Republican vs Democrat thread. That's not what it was intended to be. It's also not intended to be a BLM or Black vs White vs Brown thread.


NFL RULES!! The specific rule pertaining to the national anthem is found on pages A62-63 of the league Operations Manual. . It states:

“The National Anthem must be played prior to every NFL game, and all players must be on the sideline for the National Anthem.

“During the National Anthem, players on the field and bench area should stand at attention, face the flag, hold helmets in their left hand, and refrain from talking. The home team should ensure that the American flag is in good condition. It should be pointed out to players and coaches that we continue to be judged by the public in this area of respect for the flag and our country. Failure to be on the field by the start of the National Anthem may result in discipline, such as fines, suspensions, and/or the forfeiture of draft choice(s) for violations of the above, including first offenses.”

So, according to this, the sitters, kneelers, and disrespectful should be punished accordingly.

So, Mr. Goodell, are you going to follow your own rules or continue to be the wimp you are appearing to be?

Comments?


"Beachcomber" 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge


Anchor's down......Bottoms Up!
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#569283 - 09/27/17 08:26 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
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captkevin Offline
Admiral
captkevin  Offline
Admiral

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Chicago, IL
Nicely said GFC can't agree more with you. If they don't like it they have a choice - they can leave.


2004 Rinker 232
2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4
#569284 - 09/27/17 11:27 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: captkevin]  
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Dock Holiday Offline
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Dock Holiday  Offline
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Lake Geneva, WI
Originally Posted by captkevin
Nicely said GFC can't agree more with you. If they don't like it they have a choice - they can leave.



+1

This kneeling for the anthem bothers me in so many ways that I won't even attempt to describe my emotions and opinions on the topic. I hope more people boycott the NFL and any other celebrities that try to use their fame to influence politics (e.g. actors, musicians, etc.).




Last edited by Dock Holiday; 09/28/17 05:44 PM.
#569286 - 09/28/17 01:09 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
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KCook Offline
Admiral
KCook  Offline
Admiral

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Phoenix
It will ultimately be self-defeating. The more they do this, the sillier it will look.

ohwell

#569287 - 09/28/17 04:23 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
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tpenfield Offline
Admiral
tpenfield  Offline
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Cape Cod, MA
Standing or kneeling . . . doesn't bother me.

I think the greater matter is the $15 beer.


Regards, Ted

Formula 330SS

My Boat Web Sites
#569290 - 09/28/17 07:39 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Oct 2003
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captkevin Offline
Admiral
captkevin  Offline
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Posts: 7,228
Chicago, IL
Agree with tpenfield the cost of attending professional sports is completely out of hand & if they are not careful they can chase even more fans from attending & as GFC points out voting with there wallets.


2004 Rinker 232
2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4
#569291 - 09/28/17 08:03 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Jun 2004
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Capn Morgan Offline
Scallywag
Capn Morgan  Offline
Scallywag
Admiral

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 11,110
West Michigan
Fire those cameramen SOB's for kneeling and wearing a hat during the national anthem. The unmitigated audacity....


[Linked Image]


2004 Chaparral 235 SSi
[Linked Image]
#569294 - 09/28/17 01:27 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Nov 2003
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GoFirstClass Offline
Retired Boating Bum
GoFirstClass  Offline
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Grand Poobah

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 14,878
Pasco, WA
I think, based on what I am hearing and reading about the protest, that I have watched my last NFL game. I'm encouraging others to join me in boycotting the NFL. I posted that same message on 3 other boating forums. Among the three, all have agreed with my position and my boycott except for two people. One of those two is so far left I can't see him with binoculars, the other is left, but not off the charts.

Only when the team owners start to notice revenues dropping off will they get concerned and do something to get the players to stop the boycott.

At least that's what I'm hoping.


"Beachcomber" 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge


Anchor's down......Bottoms Up!
#569295 - 09/28/17 01:50 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 11,654
Frantically Relaxing Offline
Admiral
Frantically Relaxing  Offline
Admiral

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Posts: 11,654
Me and my BIL were arguing about this yesterday.
His position is the kneelers are dissing the flag, and the military.
My position is that I believe the kneelers contention it was a peaceful way to express their opinion about the police/shootings issues.
And I believe those who serve in the military do so, in part, to protect the players - everyones - right to peacefully protest..
Yes, I think a better venue could be found for the kneelers to get their point across. However, and just my opinion:
"I disapprove of what you say, but I'll defend with my life your right to say it" -- comes into play here.
What ended our argument, was when I pointed out "yes they're kneeling, but they did not turn their back to the flag."
THAT would rightly be considered blatant disrespect...
As for the NFL rules, I notice the word "should" is used and not the word "must", which translates to 'we would prefer that you stand' rather than 'we require you to stand'.
As for staying in the locker room, I somewhat equate that with turning their backs to the flag....
I say somewhat because, I don't think the players actually thought of it that way-- but they should.
In summary- I'll take a kneel during anthem protest over a street riot protest any day.

#569297 - 09/28/17 02:06 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 14,878
GoFirstClass Offline
Retired Boating Bum
GoFirstClass  Offline
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Grand Poobah

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 14,878
Pasco, WA
In case anyone is interested, here's a list of NFL sponsors for this season.

Current Sponsors
Anheuser-Busch
Barclaycard US
Bose
Bridgestone
Campbell's Soup Company
Castrol
Courtyard Marriott
Dairy Management, Inc. (Fuel Up to Play 60)
Dannon
Extreme Networks
FedEx
Frito-Lay
Gatorade
Hyundai Motor America
Mars Snackfood
Microsoft
Nationwide
News America
Papa John's
Pepsi
Procter & Gamble
Quaker
Verizon
Visa
USAA


"Beachcomber" 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge


Anchor's down......Bottoms Up!
#569299 - 09/29/17 01:17 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,711
Jack T Offline
Admiral
Jack T  Offline
Admiral

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,711
Southern California


Have a great day of boating
2012 Monterey 224 FS,
300 HP Volvo Penta with catalytic converters

#569300 - 09/29/17 07:55 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,284
tpenfield Offline
Admiral
tpenfield  Offline
Admiral

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,284
Cape Cod, MA
Adding to the mix of articles:

http://johnpavlovitz.com/2016/09/20/white-america-its-time-to-take-a-knee/

Although, I am not in agreement with the "cheap, ornamental nationalistic pageantry" comment.
.

Also, this video struck me; it is worth viewing . . .
.



Last edited by tpenfield; 09/29/17 11:04 AM.

Regards, Ted

Formula 330SS

My Boat Web Sites
#569301 - 09/29/17 09:11 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7,179
MarkHB Offline
Dressed for dinner
MarkHB  Offline
Dressed for dinner
Admiral

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7,179
CA
As much as I agree with you GFC about kneeling during the National Anthem, I have been unable to verify your quote.

Quote
NFL RULES!! The specific rule pertaining to the national anthem is found on pages A62-63 of the league Operations Manual


"no such wording appears in the 2017 version of the Official Playing Rules of the National Football League (which the NFL also sometimes refers to as an “operations manual”): Pages 62 and 63 contain only regulations about the enforcement of fouls committed on the field during gameplay, and nowhere else does that document specify anything about the either the playing of the national anthem prior to games or the required behavior of players and team personnel during that ceremony. In fact, the rulebook makes no mention of the national anthem at all.
Rule 4, which covers Game Timing, states only that both teams must be on the field before the scheduled start time of the first and second halves, and must initially appear on the field at least 10 minutes early in order to allow sufficient time for warming up:"

"However, some sources have confusingly stated that the NFL has a separate game operations manual distributed to all the teams, and it is that document, not the rulebook, which supposedly includes the wording in question regarding player conduct during the national anthem:"

"We have not yet been able to independently confirm the existence and wording of this second document (the NFL has not responded to our query), but the proffered wording — which league spokesman Brian McCarthy described as a “policy” rather than a “rule” — states that players must “be” on the sideline for the national anthem, not that they must “stand” on the sideline (the latter is listed only as something players “should” do). The wording also establishes that players “may” (not “shall”) be penalized for not observing the regulation, and indeed the NFL announced that they would not take any disciplinary measures over players’ remaining in the locker room before Week 3 games:"

Must NFL Players Stand

All in the name of trying to find out whether it is Fake News or Real News.

Me? Although I am not a citizen of the US, I always stand during the National Anthem.

Last edited by MarkHB; 09/29/17 09:12 AM.

24' Monterey Explorer
Honda PWC
http://www.picturetrail.com/markhb

Golf!! Waste of a good gun range.
#569302 - 09/29/17 10:24 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Jan 2003
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Jack T Offline
Admiral
Jack T  Offline
Admiral

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,711
Southern California
Here's an explanation from Truth or Fiction. Looks like there are two NFL books, NFL rulebook and a game operations manual.

https://www.truthorfiction.com/nfl-rulebook-prohibits-national-anthem-protests/

Summary of eRumor:

The NFL rulebook requires players to be on the sidelines and stand for the National Anthem, according to a Facebook post calling on NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell to punish players for protesting.

The Truth:

NFL policies regulate player and team conduct for the National Anthem — but NFL rules don’t specifically require players to stand for the National Anthem.

These claims began circulating on Facebook in September 2017 after President Donald Trump’s call for NFL owners to fire the “sons of bitches” who kneel or sit during the National Anthem sparked a firestorm of debate.

The claim that the NFL rulebook forbids National Anthem protests is false. The rulebook outlines things like basic game rules, penalties, field dimensions, clock management, etc. No policies regarding before- or after-game practices, procedures or player conduct are included in the rulebook.

Those policies are outlined in a separate NFL Game Operations Manual. The NFL states that the operations manual aims to ensure that, “like clockwork, the players appear, the National Anthem is sung and the game begins — precisely on time.”

The NFL does not make its game operations manual publicly available, but an NFL spokesperson told TIME magazine that the operations manual does regulate National Anthem procedures and player conduct:

The National Anthem must be played prior to every NFL game, and all players must be on the sideline for the National Anthem.

During the National Anthem, players on the field and bench area should stand at attention, face the flag, hold helmets in their left hand, and refrain from talking. The home team should ensure that the American flag is in good condition. It should be pointed out to players and coaches that we continue to be judged by the public in this area of respect for the flag and our country. Failure to be on the field by the start of the National Anthem may result in discipline, such as fines, suspensions, and/or the forfeiture of draft choice(s) for violations of the above, including first offenses.

According to the spokesperson’s account, the manual states that players “should” stand for the National Anthem, and that failure to be on the field before a game starts “may” result in punishment. In other words, these aren’t hard-and-fast rules — and these policies are in place to ensure games start on time, not to prevent player protests. When it comes to players refusing to stand or refusing to take the field, the NFL’s policy has been to not punish them, and the NFL has indicated that the policy won’t change going forward:


Have a great day of boating
2012 Monterey 224 FS,
300 HP Volvo Penta with catalytic converters

#569303 - 09/29/17 11:14 AM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Nov 2003
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GoFirstClass Offline
Retired Boating Bum
GoFirstClass  Offline
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Grand Poobah

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 14,878
Pasco, WA
Jack, thanks for clarifying where that language comes from.


"Beachcomber" 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge


Anchor's down......Bottoms Up!
#569307 - 09/29/17 03:56 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,276
Brian S Offline
Admiral
Brian S  Offline
Admiral

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,276
Canton, Michigan
It's the NATIONAL ANTHEM not a rap song, country song, rock song or any other trivial song. They are in a "workplace" and receive compensation way above the normal person and were heros to some. Take your distraction outside the arena prior to, after or somewhere else and show some respect. If you riot, be prepared to face the reprocusions of that choice. If it's that bad....LEAVE. Plenty are trying to get in and would be more than happy to have the chance. Funny thing....I live close to Canada border and on radio reports it's only usually backed up coming into the United States. IMO.... LOVE IT or LEAVE.

As always. Thank you for your service GFC

Last edited by Brian S; 09/29/17 04:00 PM.

2004 Chaparral 204 SSI
2016 F150 S/Crew XLT eco boost

#569311 - 09/29/17 05:06 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
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tpenfield Offline
Admiral
tpenfield  Offline
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Cape Cod, MA
I did not know this particular back story, but interesting . . .

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/h...epernick-to-go-from-sitting-to-kneeling/


Regards, Ted

Formula 330SS

My Boat Web Sites
#569328 - 10/02/17 06:07 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Nov 2003
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GoFirstClass Offline
Retired Boating Bum
GoFirstClass  Offline
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Grand Poobah

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 14,878
Pasco, WA
Sunday, instead of watching the NFL games, two neighbors and I got together to do a community service project. There's a pathway in front of our home that leads down to the shore of the Columbia. Where the path drops down the bank it's not all that steep, but it has several roots, uneven ground and loose dirt that made walking down to the river almost impossible for people with walking difficulties.

The three of us got together and built a set of steps that will allow just about anyone who is ambulatory to walk down to the river. Here's what it looked like before the steps were installed.
[Linked Image]

and here is what it looks like now. That's my cat as she gingerly makes her way down the steps for the first time.
[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

We missed an entire day of football but didn't feel like we missed a thing.

Last edited by GoFirstClass; 10/02/17 11:48 PM.

"Beachcomber" 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge


Anchor's down......Bottoms Up!
#569329 - 10/02/17 06:47 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
Joined: Dec 2002
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KCook Offline
Admiral
KCook  Offline
Admiral

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Phoenix
Smart kitty d

#569330 - 10/02/17 06:50 PM Re: I voted with my wallet....... [Re: GoFirstClass]  
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PhatboyC Offline
Always Need a Bigger Boat
PhatboyC  Offline
Always Need a Bigger Boat
Admiral

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,174
Ottawa/Ontario

Last edited by PhatboyC; 10/02/17 06:52 PM.

-------------------------------
25'.6" Cuddy Cabin - Sold
*Sold the boat after 9 wonderful years. Looking for a bigger one.
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