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#568834 - 08/16/17 12:46 PM Tips for Safe Fueling  
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Jack T Offline
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I am on the BoatTest mailing list, and this short article about fueling seemed logical that BABC is a good place to post it as well. The thing that drew my attention is the fuel absorbant "sock" that is around the filler nozzle. They call it a number of things, but fuel collar seems to be the best description. Has anybody had any experience with these devices? Seems to make sense on a boat.

Here's the link to the article
http://www.boattest.com/view-news/120

Here's fuel collar made in Texas prisons
http://www.tci.tdcj.state.tx.us/products/metal/misc/spillabsorbentfuelcollar.aspx

And one that is 10X more $ on eBay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MYCELX-FuelKleen-Fuel-Collar-/122418165699

And another
https://www.asap-supplies.com/us/mycelx-fuelkleen-splash-absorbing-fuel-collars

Last edited by Jack T; 08/16/17 01:36 PM.

Have a great day of boating
2012 Monterey 224 FS,
300 HP Volvo Penta with catalytic converters

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#568835 - 08/16/17 01:01 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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captkevin Offline
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Great idea. Could have used many times. We always fill up on the trailer & I have switched up my filling technique. I stop every 5-10 gallons & let everything settle. Try to listen for changes coming from fuel fill. Also not trying to get 100% full. Happy with 80% or so. Boat has a 75 gallon tank & we can get 5 days of boating out of a fill up.

Last edited by captkevin; 08/16/17 02:29 PM.

2004 Rinker 232
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#568839 - 08/16/17 04:47 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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tpenfield Offline
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I just use a rag around the nozzle and go slowly


Regards, Ted

Formula 330SS

My Boat Web Sites
#568840 - 08/16/17 05:03 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Frantically Relaxing Offline
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eh.

Ok I'm at the dock filling up and I'm using one of these things and a cup of gas blooshes out and this thing catches it all.. Ok, so now I have a sock full of gas. What am I supposed to do with it?


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#568841 - 08/16/17 06:25 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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captkevin Offline
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Good point


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#568844 - 08/17/17 02:18 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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WaterWing Offline
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My boat does regurgitate during filling even though its not full. I hear it coming and use a rag to catch it. The nice part about a rag (over the 'sock' product) is I can also use it as a rag for other rag needed tasks. Not sure if I need a dedicated fuel absorbent 'sock'. I'm trying to downsize as I get older.


2001 Larson SEi-230 5.7 Merc/Alpha1
2013 Ford Explorer
#569225 - 09/20/17 09:51 AM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Boatbottom Offline
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Great Sacandaga Lake Mayfield,...
Interesting discussion. If I am not careful I get fuel spitting out the vent. Part of the issue is where the manufacturers put the vent, and the orientation the tank. The vent is typically right next to the fuel fill on the tank, the aft portion of the tank is often down hill from the forward end. As you fill this traps air which compresses for a little while and then at some point expands, forcing fuel out of one of the openings. In my case it's the fuel vent. When I have a gang, I ask people to go sit on the bow of the boat, changing the tank orientation and then I don't get the fuel puking through the vent.


No Blunder goes unwitnessed
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#569226 - 09/20/17 10:22 AM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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captkevin Offline
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I have modified my filling technique with good results so far. Basically just going a little slower with the pump & stopping periodically letting things settle down.


2004 Rinker 232
2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4
#569228 - 09/20/17 01:01 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Boatbottom]  
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tpenfield Offline
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Originally Posted by Boatbottom
Interesting discussion. If I am not careful I get fuel spitting out the vent. Part of the issue is where the manufacturers put the vent, and the orientation the tank. The vent is typically right next to the fuel fill on the tank, the aft portion of the tank is often down hill from the forward end. As you fill this traps air which compresses for a little while and then at some point expands, forcing fuel out of one of the openings. In my case it's the fuel vent. When I have a gang, I ask people to go sit on the bow of the boat, changing the tank orientation and then I don't get the fuel puking through the vent.


The belly tanks used in many boats are 'supposed' to have an internal vent tube within the tank so that the fitting can be located at the rear of the tank, but the actual vent opening is at the forward end of the tank (via the internal tube). Some of the more economical tanks may not have such a feature. However, with gasoline sloshing around in the fuel tank, as it does, the vent tube/hose can easily get some gasoline in it.

Probably the best thing to do is not completely fill the tank and fill it slower than you normally would. I think it is a matter of each boat and how sensitive the design of the fuel tank and hoses are, as to the filling characteristics. My 24 foot Formula would tend to burp even when nearly empty if it was filled too fast. My 33 footer seems to be able to take fuel at a higher rate.


Regards, Ted

Formula 330SS

My Boat Web Sites
#569229 - 09/20/17 02:33 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Jack T Offline
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On our previous boat, I had a similar problem, although the vent was some distance from the fill. Someone told me that if drilled a small hold in the fill cap, this would release pressure from the front and rear of the tank. For some reason, this fixed the problem.


Have a great day of boating
2012 Monterey 224 FS,
300 HP Volvo Penta with catalytic converters

#569235 - 09/20/17 07:45 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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kdl Offline
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tpenfield brings up a good point.

If not routed correctly, liquid will collect in any low points of the hose leading to the vent preventing the vent from working. With the gas cap removed, a small amount of compressed air blown into the vent will clear the line.


2005 Cobalt 246 8.1 Gi
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#569255 - 09/24/17 07:58 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Lou C Offline
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1) get a fuel vapor detector. They are not expensive and are pretty easy to install.
2) close all hatches and the engine cover before fueling up
3) shut off the blower while fueling, because on some boats if the fresh air intake is on the same side as the gas filler it can actually suck fuel vapors IN the bilge which is what you are trying to avoid.
4) always use your nose after fueling up.
5) run the blower for 4 min after fueling up.

I can't tell you how many times, I have seen I/O and inboards at the fuel dock and people just turn on the blower and hit the starter after fueling. Most people do NOT sniff the bilge. Even the gas dock attendants are unaware of this.

Also:
Inspect your whole fuel system at the start of each season. Make sure to lift up the gas tank hatch or access cover to sniff around the sending unit gasket, and hoses there. Tighten hose clamps, check condition of the hoses. Even on out boards.

Last edited by Lou C; 09/24/17 08:00 PM.

88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 Six Selectrac
07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 HEMI Quadradrive II
#569256 - 09/24/17 08:05 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Lou C Offline
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https://seastriper.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32182

read this
caution: graphic pix
this was an outboard boat by the way....


88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 Six Selectrac
07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 HEMI Quadradrive II
#569257 - 09/24/17 09:28 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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captkevin Offline
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You can't access the thread Lou without being signed on.


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2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4
#569259 - 09/24/17 09:38 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Lou C Offline
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Well here's the cliff notes version:
the poster had a 2005 Seaswirl Striper that he bought used, and he had some water in the bilge, and a faint gas smell. This is an outboard powered boat by the way...........Here's the story:

Hi everyone, I'm Lewis. I became a Seaswirl owner in February 2017 when I purchased a 2101 WA w/ 200 Yam. I looked and waited to find this specific boat as I loved the look and design of Seaswirls. Anyhow, the boat had 244 hrs on it and ran perfect, never had any issues or reasons to assume issues. I checked everything over, or so I thought, pretty thoroughly. I made numerous trips in it since buying up to Memorial Day weekend. I completely filled up the tank, which I had never done, as I knew it was going to be a long weekend. We proceeded to go out into the Gulf fishing that day. While being out for couple hours I noticed a faint gas smell. I ran bilge, it emptied alittle bit which I thought was odd, but figured just water from loading and spray while running out. Continued on with our day until docking about 4pm at the house. After turning battery off and tying up the boat and I decided to turn my battery switch back on to run bilge one more time so that I could see the next day if anything accumulated. When I turned it on all hell hit me. I was immediately consumed but fire from the battery hatch and from the gas tank access hatch which blew off. My fight or flight kicked in and I dove over the port side into the water. What I didn't know is that the fire was coming from the floor and I couldn't see so I basically jumped right through it. The fire lasted maybe 3 seconds. It was all fumes thankfully as I basically had a full tank. The fire left me in the burn unit at University of South Alabama for 19 days. I am fine now, but will have scars and hopefully not too many issues down the road. After hiring an attorney and having numerous investigations done, it turns out the fuel sending unit screws were completely stripped out leaving it basically sitting on the tank. So when I filled up my tank it cause the unit to be pushed out some or more easily moved due to the tank being completely full. I am trying to find out if any work was done on the tank by the previous owners, but haven't gotten all that answered yet. I am writing this and showing the pics to hopefully save the trouble and harm for someone else. The spark that caused this came from my battery somehow. It was just the right conditions. I was very blessed to only suffer the injuries I did as well as no one else getting hurt. I had just taken my 3 girls ages 9, 6,and 4, off the boat not 30 seconds before. Sorry for dragging the story out, but I just wanted everyone to know that it was a normal boat day like I'm sure everyone has. Mine just happened to end in a bad way.

Last edited by Lou C; 09/24/17 09:40 PM.

88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 Six Selectrac
07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 HEMI Quadradrive II
#569260 - 09/24/17 09:46 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Lou C Offline
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And the moral of the story is...sniff always sniff if you smell gas....do not turn anything electrical on....
check all fuel system components every year and make sure to lift up those access panels and check the sending unit gasket, screws, wiring, and all hoses.

Last point...
I know that nearly everyone will say, the bilge pump & auto switch should be connected so that it cannot be shut off by turning off the battery switches, for the obvious reason that the boat could sink if it took on water when docked or moored.

Well I disagree, and I have mine wired so then the battery switch is off EVERYTHING IS OFF. In the event that I ever had a fuel leak, the last thing I want, is the auto bilge switch to turn on the pump! I just have to leave the batt switch on either #1 or #2 when the boat is moored. I never turn it off when its moored and have never had problems this way. If others used the boat besides myself I'd just put a sign ("do not shut off battery switch when leaving boat, leave on #1 or #2).....

Last edited by Lou C; 09/24/17 09:47 PM.

88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 Six Selectrac
07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 HEMI Quadradrive II
#569261 - 09/24/17 10:03 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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captkevin Offline
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Scary story thanks for sharing.


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2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4
#569269 - 09/25/17 09:39 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Boatbottom Offline
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Great Sacandaga Lake Mayfield,...
Hi Jack T. In my case the only time the vent pukes gasoline is during the filling process. Once I am done filling the boat there are no issues.

tpenfield, I was unaware of the tank design you speak of. I haven't taken the vent apart so I don't know about my tank. I think the vent simply connects to tank a few inches from the fill.

Lou C, I am one of the few that actually runs the blower for 4 minutes before leaving the gas dock. On more than one ocasion, the dock attended has scolded me for taking so long to start the boat after fueling.


No Blunder goes unwitnessed
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#569270 - 09/25/17 09:57 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Boatbottom Offline
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Great Sacandaga Lake Mayfield,...
Regarding the Sea Swirl incident. In 1987 I purchased a new 22ft SunRunner cuddy cabin boat. I only had the boat about a month when my wife mentioned she smelled gasoline. I inspected the fittings on the tank, and could see that the fuel sender mounting plate had gasoline weeping around a couple of the screws in tiny amounts. Two of the screws were stripped. I turned everyting off. Went out and got oversized screws, removed, rebedded and reinstalled the fuel sender. Gasoline has a very low oder detection threshold (easy to detect/smell). So...when somebody says they smell gasoline you need to track it down right away

I took my little 15' pontoon boat with the 40hp yamaha outboard for a ride. I kept smelling gasoline and couldn't figure out where it was comming from. The two 6 gallon tanks sit on platforms at the stern of the boat outside the cockpit area. Finally I stopped the boat and started checking each of the fuel connections. As it turns out when I filled one of the fuel tanks I hadn't tightened the cap properly (really smart). I'm glad it wasn't a fuel tank sitting in the bilge of an inboard or sterndrive boat. I might not be making these comments.


No Blunder goes unwitnessed
Blowers are Cheap Fires Are Expensive
#569273 - 09/26/17 04:04 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Lou C Offline
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I've gotten looks from people a few times with the hatch open and blower on. 4 min is really not a long time. Then I see people wasting time, blabbing with the attendants, hosing off their boats, doing things I find really annoying.
Once I tried to educate one of the attendants at the less busy dock I go to. He had no idea of the risk of not checking for fumes with a gas inboard. I told him if the boater does not check or run the blower step away from the boat, far away lol...

Last edited by Lou C; 09/26/17 04:05 PM.

88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 Six Selectrac
07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 HEMI Quadradrive II
#569279 - 09/27/17 08:46 AM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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2Suns Offline
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I used to have a mid 90's sea ray 180. The fuel vent was up at the front of the boat and would puke out gas when filling. I found a check valve that was sold as a device to stop it. I was skeptical but it worked.


By the time they had diminished from 50 to 8, the other dwarves began to suspect "Hungry.-Gary Larson
#569285 - 09/28/17 01:55 AM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Frantically Relaxing Offline
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I don't even run a bilge blower. It's probably one reason why I didn't blow up our Sun Runner when the main fuel inlet hose was leaking. And there was the first time I fueled up the SkipperLiner, and came back 2 weeks later, and smelled gas. Some boaters would've turned the blower on to get rid of the fumes. There was over 40 gallons of gas in the blige, and if I'd turned on the blower it's quite likely we'd been blown to kingdom-come. Me, I sniff, as BB noted above, raw gas is very easy to smell. Just my opinion but a bilge blower is oxymoronic- If I don't smell gas, I don't need it. If I DO smell, gas, the LAST thing I'd do is switch it on. And I don't buy into the 'ignition protected' BS. Bilge pumps are supposed to be, and look what happened to Lewis. Any whatsoever compromised wire connection is all it takes.

If I smell gas after fueling- like with the Sun Runner (which has been the only time in my boating life), I'll open the hatch and wait until it's aired out to suit me.


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#569288 - 09/28/17 07:24 AM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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tpenfield Offline
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FR you bring up a good point. There is a UL standard - UL 1128 - that covers bilge blowers and their spark suppression. I am not sure if all blowers comply with such, but you would think that they should.

One would think that with the purpose of the blower to rid (dilute) the engine compartment of explosive fumes, should they be present, that the blower itself should tolerate fumes without causing an explosion.


Regards, Ted

Formula 330SS

My Boat Web Sites
#569289 - 09/28/17 08:35 AM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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captkevin Offline
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This thread makes some great points that i never gave much thought to..

Last edited by captkevin; 09/28/17 08:41 AM.

2004 Rinker 232
2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4
#569296 - 09/28/17 03:01 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Jack T Offline
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Jack T  Offline
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Southern California
Here's the specific California Law. Looks like it is dated 1983

https://govt.westlaw.com/calregs/Document/I6BF30B50D48611DEBC02831C6D6C108E?viewType=FullText&originationContext=documenttoc&transitionType=CategoryPageItem&contextData=(sc.Default)

Here's a brief of the UL 1128, 3rd Edition, Published: 09/25/1997, Full standard is 24 pages

https://www.techstreet.com/standards/ul-1128?product_id=20099#full


Have a great day of boating
2012 Monterey 224 FS,
300 HP Volvo Penta with catalytic converters

#569468 - 10/22/17 09:26 PM Re: Tips for Safe Fueling [Re: Jack T]  
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Boatbottom Offline
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Boatbottom  Offline
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Great Sacandaga Lake Mayfield,...
Ventillation systems on gasoline powered boats are regulated by 33CFR 183.610. In addition to the requirements in the regulation, it incorporates by reference several other standards such as UL and ASTM. I didn't go read them all and I'm not a lawyer, but I think the upshot is that blowers in gasoline powered boats are required and the blowers are required to be ignition protected. For Frantically Relaxing a sniff test is certainly great. No gasoline odor? No fire or exposion. Your blower however would not have ignited fumes unless it was defective.


No Blunder goes unwitnessed
Blowers are Cheap Fires Are Expensive
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