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#464996 - 07/02/09 09:20 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Frantically Relaxing]
230 Mike Offline
Admiral

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 4096
Loc: Kansas City
She's WAAAAAAAAAY out of line. Photog's are a dime a dozen, and most of them are doing anything they can to make a buck. I certainly don't begrudge someone charging for their work, but the way she went about this is beyond offensive.
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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
'98 F150 XLT
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#465140 - 07/06/09 01:51 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Waterdog]
GoFirstClass Offline
Boating Bum

Registered: 11/21/03
Posts: 9909
Loc: Pasco, WA
Originally Posted By: Waterdog
Just don't want the Admiral to loose a friend over this......After reflecting on this with a cooler head, I believe she's just naive rather than trying to stick it to us.

If you take this position in your discussions with her the talks will likely go better. Assume for now that she is naive and made a mistake in judgement when she asked you to pay her.

If you take the high road and do that, the situation will be much easier to resolve to the satisfaction of all involved.
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"Beachcomber", 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge, and "Cool Change" 89 Reinell 19'er...

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#465164 - 07/06/09 07:55 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: GoFirstClass]
power and sail Offline
Admiral

Registered: 01/04/04
Posts: 1093
Loc: SE
she does have copyrights to the pictures though, but since they were taken in your store you may have some other rights that protect you, legally. You don't want to go there though.

I agree a blunt discussion along the lines that she must have misunderstood the situation and she for sure did not mean to charge you, did she, after she got the space for free, or did she plan on paying for the space even if you did not ask her to (at this early stage of her business, and yours)later it may be proper for her to pay a commission on sold pix.

mho
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power and sail
enjoying both

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#465271 - 07/07/09 01:22 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: power and sail]
Heyboer Offline
Admiral

Registered: 05/30/07
Posts: 590
Loc: Chicago
According to my very part-time photog wife....in a gallery it's a 50/50 split on items sold. No rental cost to the artist. FWIW. Your situation is a bit "unique".

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#465632 - 07/11/09 10:44 AM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Heyboer]
Bowline Offline
Cruising Texoma

Registered: 01/14/03
Posts: 5011
Loc: Kansas City, MO/Frisco, TX
So, how'd it turn out? Did you have to visit HD for a reciprocating saw or did it turn out amicably?
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#465802 - 07/13/09 01:23 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Bowline]
Waterdog Offline
Admiral

Registered: 07/27/04
Posts: 1076
Loc: Athens, GA
Originally Posted By: Bowline
So, how'd it turn out? Did you have to visit HD for a reciprocating saw or did it turn out amicably?


Already have a reciprocating saw, but I'm always looking for an excuse for a new tool....

Anyway, I exited from the "conversation" which was not going well. The photog said that the photos are hers and that she can't give her "art" away. And, she made the argument that because she posted about us in her photog blog (and linked to our online store), it was equal to us displaying her photos in our store. I disagreed 100% since her blog is poorly followed. Plus, using Google Analytics, I can see that only 3 people have clicked thru to our website with no sales conversions. The Admiral is still negotiating with her which is fine. We need a couple of the pics the photographer took for a print ad deadline due this week. Once we get those, I'll contact some other photographers and see if we can't work something out that is beneficial to both of us. She can them come pick up her pics which will be neatly stacked next to the dumpster out back. Artists. Sheesh.
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05 FW 200 Horizon

Always remember Rule #6.
http://www.thenaturalbaby.com

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#465803 - 07/13/09 01:29 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Heyboer]
Waterdog Offline
Admiral

Registered: 07/27/04
Posts: 1076
Loc: Athens, GA
Originally Posted By: Heyboer
According to my very part-time photog wife....in a gallery it's a 50/50 split on items sold. No rental cost to the artist. FWIW. Your situation is a bit "unique".


Just to clarify - her pics on display are just for promotional purposes - they are not for sale. So, no sales proceeds in it for us. Our store customers can take the photographer's business cards and contact her directly if they are interested in scheduling a photo shoot. We derive nothing from the display itself. Just seemed like a mutually beneficial situation - "we provide a free display space since you don't have a studio. You provide us with some free photos of our store from time to time."
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05 FW 200 Horizon

Always remember Rule #6.
http://www.thenaturalbaby.com

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#465804 - 07/13/09 01:58 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Waterdog]
Wet Doggg Offline
Admiral

Registered: 01/12/03
Posts: 6246
Loc: Rockford, Michigan
Wow...can't believe you and your wife are keeping your cool. Good for you guys I guess. He business will not succeed with poor business practices like this.
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2000 Four Winns 230 - the new Wet Doggg
2007 Nissan Armada
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#465829 - 07/13/09 05:40 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Wet Doggg]
Philr Offline
Admiral

Registered: 03/20/03
Posts: 2212
Loc: Rock Island, IL
I vote for everyone picking up their toys and going home.....
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The best thing about being wrong is the joy it brings others.

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#465840 - 07/13/09 08:22 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Philr]
captkevin Offline
Admiral

Registered: 10/02/03
Posts: 3402
Loc: Chicago, IL
It is usually better not to mix business & friends. One of my best friends is a contractor & every time I have hired him to do a job it creates some friction. If I hire him to do something now we have a formal quote that describes scope of the job & price. That way no one can have any memory issues.
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99 Four Winns 200
2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4

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#466013 - 07/15/09 03:12 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Waterdog]
Frantically Relaxing Offline
Play It Forward

Registered: 02/07/03
Posts: 8520
Originally Posted By: Waterdog
... The photog said that the photos are hers and that she can't give her "art" away.
Why not? You gave away advertising space, what's the difference? Geez, is her head that freaking big? Her "art" is nothing more than reflections of light focused thru some glass and captured on a CCD panel (or film for the old school). That means practically everyone reading this is an "artist"...
rolleyes

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Hello. My name is Kevin. And I'm addicted to boats.

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#466683 - 07/23/09 09:43 AM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Frantically Relaxing]
Waterdog Offline
Admiral

Registered: 07/27/04
Posts: 1076
Loc: Athens, GA
Seriously, folks! I am just dumbfounded by some of the people that are approaching us recently. The photog thing has never been adequately resolved - the Admiral is overwhelmed with everything else she needs to work on with the store and I have removed myself from that situation so it continues on....

Just thought I would rant about the latest. We had two "medical professionals" approach us regarding offering infant massage classes out of our store. We met with them yesterday. Their offer? They would offer at least once weekly infant massage classes to parents in our area. They would use our large store front to hold the classes in the evenings after we close for business. They asked us to advertise the classes on our website and with fliers. They are willing to pay us $0 for the use of our space!! bug_eyes "Hmmm", we said, "What's in it for us?" They said they would be bringing customers into our store and that was payment enough. Really? I mean REALLY? We pay a significant amount for rent and utilities and advertising and furnishings. We are a FOR PROFIT organization.

The Admiral was polite and said we'd think about. Yeah, I'm thinking how totally frickin' nuts they are. The problem is, these aren't the only people that have approached us about using our space for free. I can think of two other groups off hand, not to mention the several phone messages we don't even return. Maybe I'm the one who is nuts. [/Rant off]
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05 FW 200 Horizon

Always remember Rule #6.
http://www.thenaturalbaby.com

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#466686 - 07/23/09 10:33 AM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Waterdog]
captkevin Offline
Admiral

Registered: 10/02/03
Posts: 3402
Loc: Chicago, IL
Wow it never ceases to amaze what some people have the courage to ask for freebies. They were going to pay you nothing yet risk you to the exposure of liability if someone got hurt on you property all at no gain for you - can't see why you didn't jump on that.
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99 Four Winns 200
2010 Dodge Ram Crew Cab Laramie 4x4

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#466694 - 07/23/09 01:57 PM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: captkevin]
Cobalt24sx Offline
"Rough Draft"

Registered: 07/19/06
Posts: 709
Loc: Virginia
Not so sure your general liability insurance would cover a claim as a result of another business utilizing your leased property. All it takes is a slip and fall. Wouldn't you also have to staff the store for any potential sales and for security as well?
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"Rough Draft" 2006 Cobalt 24sx Volvo 5.7L GiDP F5's
Curiosity killed the cat, satisfaction brought him back.

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#466731 - 07/24/09 06:51 AM Re: Some advice on a "business" situation [Re: Cobalt24sx]
Waterdog Offline
Admiral

Registered: 07/27/04
Posts: 1076
Loc: Athens, GA
Have a call into our insurance agent about our liability. I believe we would be liable regardless of whether we charge for use of the space or not. And, yes, we would have to staff the store (which means either my wife or me) for the unlikely event of a sale.

The 2 "medical professionals" that want to do this are acting like we are the bad guys for not jumping on the opportunity to provide free space, for not opening ourselves up to additional liability, for not paying to run over 5000 watts of lights, the HVAC, rent, etc. What were we thinking? idn Maybe we should offer to pay them. mad
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05 FW 200 Horizon

Always remember Rule #6.
http://www.thenaturalbaby.com

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