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#438430 - 10/04/08 06:01 PM High-Def TV's
justforfun Offline
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Before Christmas, we will be making our 1st foray into the high-def arena - and we don't know much about them shocked

Here is what I know so far: 720 vs 1080; plasma vs LCD; contrast ratio - higher = better (see - I don't know much)

What should i look for? Plasma or LCD? Best brands?

I would love to hear from those that have been there already.
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#438433 - 10/04/08 06:14 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: justforfun]
D-Rod Offline
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LCD

LCD again.

LCD again again.

Okie. That's enough. The rest is just benefit justification. Does the picture look better on brand X TV enough to justify the extra $100 over brand Y TV.


Edited by D-Rod (10/04/08 06:15 PM)
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#438442 - 10/04/08 06:51 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: D-Rod]
kenhdog Offline
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IMHO,

LCD up to and around 32"

Plasma Over 40"

LCD Leaders: Samsung, Sharp, Sony?

Plasma: Panasonic

P.S. Don't be too fooled in stores with the pictures that are showing. Play with them and read about them. Some manufacturers have their Contrast setting pumped to the max in default mode to scream 'look at me' as you walk by all the sets.

Look at the text - is it crisp?, is it blooming, showing ghosts (too much contrast).
Look at high speed action like football, track or soccer - does the grass blur or go mosaic as the picture moves?
How well does the TV show ANALOG signals - yes, you'd be suprised how bad some digital TVs handle an analog (Standard Def) signal.
Play with the set, Go into the menus - Set the Brightness, Color, Contrast, Tint to their mid settings and compare, as much as apples to apples as you can get.
Is it a HDTV (Built in ATSC tuner) or just a HD capable monitor (no tuner)?
If a tuner, you could also probably hook up a generic UHF antenna and get some local HD (and SD) digital channels if you are in range of local broadcast signals.

Prices:
Up to 32", LCD I'd expect to pay $500 - $800
Around 42" Plasmas, I'd expect to pay $1000 - $1500, and probably have ~$1200 in mind/budget, just for planning purposes.

Good Luck.
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#438443 - 10/04/08 06:56 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: kenhdog]
D-Rod Offline
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I'd due LCD up to 46"
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#438444 - 10/04/08 06:57 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: D-Rod]
CJS Offline
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I dig LCDs too, and I've been really happy with our Sony 32" Bravia XBR. I honestly don't know crap about TVs, but I can see the difference in picture quality between this TV and others, which is why I bought it. We also have a (now archaic) Hitachi 51" 1080i HD Rear Projector that blew away contemporary flat-panel monitors, back in 2003. It's still a fantastic TV, but we don't use it very often. The smaller one gets more use due to its location in the main living area of the house.

I also looked at a Sharp Aquos that I liked a lot, when we got the smaller TV. It came down to price, and the Sony won. I've never looked back.
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#438448 - 10/04/08 08:07 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: CJS]
FormulaFanMN Offline
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You surprise me D-Rod saying LCD so many times !!! Just kidding !!

I would say that for the $$$ you really can't compare anything to Panasonic Plasmas. LCDs are nice, but they still can't compete in the critical viewing arena. They are getting close, but hopefully the OLED can come down in price because it shows great promise.

I hope OLED is what the Triniton was for TV many decades ago.
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#438449 - 10/04/08 08:17 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: FormulaFanMN]
Andyk2 Offline
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I would take into consideration what viewing angle you will be watching from. While much improved, LCDs still lack some brightness from the sides. Consider a DLP by Samsung or LG if anyone will be looking at an angle. Make sure it is one with an LED bulb, they should last much longer.

Side note, has anyone ever seen the mirror chip from a DLP? Way cool. Think about it, a million mirrors on about an inch and a quarter surface.
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#438452 - 10/04/08 08:36 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: Andyk2]
captkevin Offline
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Plasma rocks. Have a 50" Samsung 1080p in our bedroom. Great picture. LCD is ok for small tv's but if you are looking for a really nice large tv plasma 1080p is the way to. Picture from the Bluray is incredible.
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#438454 - 10/04/08 08:43 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: Andyk2]
D-Rod Offline
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Get an LCD unless you want to replace the TV in the very near future....
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#438492 - 10/05/08 07:27 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: D-Rod]
That English Guy Offline
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I recently bought a 42" LCD tv and the biggest tip I got from the store was that Plasma tv's tend to have a lot more glare and aren't ideal in well lit areas but look better in dimmer light. It was noticeable in the store the glare off of the plasma compared to the LCD.
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#438498 - 10/05/08 07:56 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: That English Guy]
trooplewis Offline
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The better plasmas have anti-glare glass, so that should not be a factor. They (plasmas) have about a 10-year life expectancy.

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#438518 - 10/05/08 10:55 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: That English Guy]
kenhdog Offline
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Originally Posted By: That English Guy
...look better in dimmer light.


Funny you brought this up.

Just an FYI: I bought a TV calibration DVD and one thing was mentioned is the amount of light that TV is meant (NTSC spec-wise) to be watched at.

It is lower than you think. I'm sure not many of us do it, but it is actually pretty dim.

One of the things suggested after making the settings was to watch the TV for a week or so at the adjusted settings, so you can get used to it. (I still bumped up the brightness (black level) a bit for my tastes, but that was an interesting piece of knowledge.



Edited by kenhdog (10/05/08 11:48 AM)
Edit Reason: typo
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#438525 - 10/05/08 11:42 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: kenhdog]
Bankonit27 Offline
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Plasma... Panasonic. We have a LCD HD and a Plasma HD, plasma without a doubt.
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#438530 - 10/05/08 12:42 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: Bankonit27]
seadog Offline
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Plasma or LCD, the difference is not great any more due to improvements in each technology. My big problem with plasma is the weight compared to the LCD. If you decide to mount the TV on a wall, you will be more comfortable with hanging the LCD.

If you want a good HDTV at a bargain, get the Sanyo 42" or 46". Wal-Mart has them for $850 and $1100. If you want the best quality at a fair price, you can find some good deals on the Sony LCDs.
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#438594 - 10/05/08 08:52 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: D-Rod]
captkevin Offline
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Originally Posted By: D-Rod
Get an LCD unless you want to replace the TV in the very near future....


Manufacturer figures for longevity are closely guarded but I have added some here for your review:

Panasonic: States in new specifications that new plasma TVs and monitors are good to 60,000 to half life.

Sony:Now out of the plasma market. Does not list a figure for LCD lineup.

Samsung: Lists 60,000 hours for plasma lineup.

Pioneer: States 60,000 hours of use in their 2008 models.

Sharp LCD panels: States 60,000 hour life.
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#438596 - 10/05/08 08:56 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: captkevin]
D-Rod Offline
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Good point CaptK. The lives have extended some. However, with age, the picture quality goes down. frown

We (well, my parents) have two 36" LCD that serve their purpose. Both are entry level units in bedrooms.


Edited by D-Rod (10/05/08 08:58 PM)
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#438597 - 10/05/08 09:06 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: D-Rod]
Dock Holiday Offline
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By the time the PQ has been noticeably diminished, the TV will be obsolete. Both LCD and Plasma will be obsolete in 5 years.

LCD and Plasma both have their strengths. Which is best depends on usage, conditions, and preferences.

I have two 37" plasmas, and one 32" LCD. IMHO, the plasmas kick but on the LCD, especially with non-HD content, but do suffer from glare.

If the TV will be used by kids, video games, on all the time, or in a bright room, LCD may be the better choice.

If the TV will be used for movies, in a light controlled room, or with non-HD content, or larger than 42", plasma may be the better choice.

The larger the TV, the more difference HD makes. On my 37" plasmas, HD vs regular def is not a large difference.

Whatever you get, make sure it is 1080. This will be worthwhile when most future content is 1080.
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#438662 - 10/06/08 09:47 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: Dock Holiday]
CDA_Boater Offline
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Plasma or LCD. Both look good and will provide you with wonderful television viewing. I prefer LCD for 2 reasons:

1. Weight - As mention above LCDs are not as heavy as Plasmas.

2. Power Consumption - Plasmas use much more power then a comparable LCD. This causes plasmas to run much warmer.

In the end it is really up to your taste. Look at several different units in several different stores. Ask the salesperson for the remote so you can play with the screen adjustments. When playing with it ask yourself:

1. How easy is it navigate the menus using the remote?

2. Are the functions you will use the most easily accessable either with buttons on the remote or through the menus?

Look at the picture from off angles to determine how clear/bright the picture is when viewed (Plasma will rock here, but LCDs have come a long way in this area).
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#438679 - 10/06/08 10:29 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: CDA_Boater]
captkevin Offline
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Don't forget DLP. While you can't mount them on the wall you get alot more bang for your buck. We have a 63" Samsung 1080p DLP and the picture it great. They have really come down in prices. Have seen 63" going for $1500 & up. Unfortnately we paid about 2 times that 3 years ago.
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#438738 - 10/06/08 01:59 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: captkevin]
deepv Offline
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Don't tell me about that! Paid $2,700 for a 32" Samsung 720p LCD in October 2003. Now a 1080p LCD from Samsung can be had for under $800 and the 720p's are even less...
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#438820 - 10/06/08 08:34 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: deepv]
rollofire Offline
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we have both plasma an lcd, 50" plasma in family room great tv
have 37"lcd in our bedroom an kids have 32"lcds in thier rooms and i really like how clear the lcd picture is. also cda boater is right the plasmas run very hot. we have 52 lcd at work an we are very disapointed in the picture an also the viewing from the side is limited. so is viewing from front if the tv is not at eye level u must tilt it down. stick with lcd in smaller tv sizes...
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#438839 - 10/07/08 12:11 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: deepv]
Silverbullet Offline
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Originally Posted By: deepv
Don't tell me about that! Paid $2,700 for a 32" Samsung 720p LCD in October 2003. Now a 1080p LCD from Samsung can be had for under $800 and the 720p's are even less...


Oh you would hate me then. We got our 50" Plasma 1080i for about $800.

Anyway, we have 3 flat panels in the house. A 50" Plasma, 42" LCD and a 27" LCD.

The 42" is 1080p and looks sharper though it might be an illusion since we don't have anything to play at 1080p.

In reality, I would go either way based on size that fits your needs and price.

I would not be buying anything right now. Wait anothe couple of weeks until the holiday sales start. Word is that the best prices will be end of October to Mid November. Then after Christmas.

There should be some good deals out there that you don't have to wait in line all night for.


Edited by Silverbullet (10/07/08 12:11 AM)
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#438890 - 10/07/08 09:02 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: Silverbullet]
BToran Offline
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we just went thru the same thing. setting the lcd vs plasma debate aside for a moment, you need to consider what else needs to be upgraded to get the most out of your new tv. for instance, plan on a digital cable box. better yet, get one with a built in digital dvr. as far as dvd's go, if blue ray is out of your price range (or you don't own a gaming system that can accept blue ray disks), consider an upconverting dvd player. they're only about $50 and while they won't play at blue ray resolutions, they will play at higher resolutions than older dvd players and if you've got a collection of dvd's, the newer ones will look fantastic because they're recorded at a higher resolution than the older dvd players could manage. older dvd's however, were recorded at the maximum resolution of the older dvd players so they'll look the same. also consider a universal remote because you'll have so many remotes it'll drive you bonkers. check with your cable provider to see if they supply hdmi cables, which are used to connect the high def components (tv to dvd player and tv to cable box, for instance). These cables are insanely priced in any store and if you need to get some, purchase them on-line from amazon.com in advance and get them MUCH cheaper. now that we're in high def, I cringe watching tv shows that haven't converted to high def yet. the reason is that they actually look WORSE than on your old tv because your new tv will try to do some kind of digital enhancement and none of them do a good job. finally, and this is no joke, now that we're fully in high def, i either need new prescription glasses or eye surgery as I'M now the weakest link in the chain.


Edited by BToran (10/07/08 09:45 AM)
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#438894 - 10/07/08 09:10 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: BToran]
captkevin Offline
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www.crutchfield.com is a great resorce for information as well as pricing. They have lots on areas that give you comparisions and explain what is what.
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#438902 - 10/07/08 09:30 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: Silverbullet]
deepv Offline
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Originally Posted By: Silverbullet
Originally Posted By: deepv
Don't tell me about that! Paid $2,700 for a 32" Samsung 720p LCD in October 2003. Now a 1080p LCD from Samsung can be had for under $800 and the 720p's are even less...


Oh you would hate me then. We got our 50" Plasma 1080i for about $800.


My only joy is having been able to watch HDTV for 5 years, even though there wasn't much programing back then. Just like thumbing through the DVD's on a single carasell at Hollywood Video in 1997 trying to find one that I hadn't rented yet.
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#438903 - 10/07/08 09:32 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: captkevin]
Cycleboater Offline
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Keep talking gentlemen. I'm learing here. My wife and I are buying ourselves a flat screen tv with a surround sound stereo for Christmas this year. I started down this route 4 years ago and got confused and scarred off by the prices and bought a tube television. Today's pricing is more in line with what I am willing to spend on a TV.
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#439042 - 10/07/08 11:47 PM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: Cycleboater]
kenhdog Offline
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Beware of the connections when you go to view HDTV's in the store.

HD trivia/ramblings:

High Definition signals are only available through Component (separate R/G/B) connections or through DVI or HDMI connections. (look behind the set and see what's connnected). (e.g. Circuit City, Best Buy, Costco will probably be connected RGB. Target, Walmart will probably be connected F-Type (likely SD), not doing them justice for what the connected sets can really can do.)

If you see a HDTV connected via a F-Type (coax) connector it is quite possibly not showing HD content UNLESS it is picking up (internal ATSC Tuner tuning in) a local Digital OTA (Over the Air) channel broadcasting HD content/programming (Digital channels can also broadcast SD content).

Connections over S-Video or composite (yellow plug) video are not HD, although S-Video is better than composite in capable SD resolutions.

HD is a spec, basically 720P and higher, wide screen (16:9) and Dolby 5.1 (AC-3) sound.

Just some thoughts....
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#439056 - 10/08/08 06:43 AM Re: High-Def TV's [Re: kenhdog]
D-Rod Offline
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You want to hook up DVI (which is HDMI, HDMI just also includes audio). Ken makes a good point. Component video uses three cables for video, 2 for audio. HDMI is one cable for both video and audio but it's digital format thus a clearer picture.

I don't like the internal tuner cards much. They're not as clear and fast at translating, IMHO. Most seem to be built with cost in mind, not power to produce a good image.

Unless you're needed 50' cable run, definitely go with HDMI. Also, I forget who said it (running short on time this morning) but LCD generally do provide a more crisp image, especially if viewing up close.


Edited by D-Rod (10/08/08 06:45 AM)
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#439237 - 10/08/08</