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#430957 - 08/22/08 09:06 AM Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed?
Parrott_head Offline
Admiral of Vice
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Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
My laptop no longer connects to my wireless router. When I go into the settings for the router is shows different mac address for the laptop then what is currently has.

How could my MAC address changed? I reloaded a saved, working config back into my router but it showed the same addy. The other laptop works fine.
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#430959 - 08/22/08 09:11 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
HotByte Offline
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Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 7445
Loc: Barnesville, GA
Typically they can't change. Could it be someone else picking up your wireless? Is this Windows XP? You can go to Status|Support on your wireless card and see its MAC address.
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#430971 - 08/22/08 09:37 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: HotByte]
Admin Administrator Offline
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Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 2613
Loc: Cyberland
It may be someone piggy-backing on your connection.

Do you have MAC filtering turned on?

If you do, turn it off. MAC filtering is one of the great fallacies of wireless security. It can actually be worse than worthless to implement as you just might be learning.

MAC filtering is only a mild annoyance to someone who wants to use your connection.

Just be sure to enable WPA (forget that WEP exists) and use a strong password. You can still be cracked, but not so easily. Most war drivers will just tune into one of your neighbors who are completely open.

For that matter, don’t waste time with things like hiding your SSID or disabling DHCP. You gain no security advantage and only give yourself more work to do when connecting a new device to the network.
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#430978 - 08/22/08 09:48 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Admin]
athiker Offline
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Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 2454
Loc: Lake Norman, NC
This arena is not my strong point but I recently set up a home wireless network. My laptop worked fine but was having a devil of a time with one desktop as well as trying to allow a visitor to access. A friend suggested switching from WEP to WPA-PSK as mentioned by Admin above. It was like magic.

Interesting comments about MAC filtering and SSID and DHCP. I'll have to remember that if I run into problems.
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#431094 - 08/22/08 04:13 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: athiker]
kenhdog Offline
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Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 2371
Loc: Oxnard, CA
Jeez admin, what do you have turned ON?? crazy funny

Sounds like you're saying that if you don't have/use WPA, then don't bother with anything... shocked

I'm of the philosophy that I do what I can, using as many reasonable measures and features at my disposal, but like anything else, know that if they want in, they'll get in. idn

Like locking my car, not too effective, but all I got. Slap a club on it, and a little bit more deterence, add an audio alarm indicator (red light) and a little bit more. Although hoping that all these deter them to another potential 'easier' victim, but knowing that if they really want it they'll get it....

Leaving everything open/off as being useless, doesn't strike me as prudent... rolleyes
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#431346 - 08/24/08 02:59 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: kenhdog]
Parrott_head Offline
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Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
Well my MAC addy in my laptop somehow got changed. Checked it against the old config that I had saves when I set this up and it is different.

I went into my router and put the new addy in. Not sure if that is the best course of action or not.

My kids use this one a lot so I will quiz them about how this might have happened.
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#431347 - 08/24/08 03:03 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
Parrott_head Offline
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Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
I'm kind of like Kenhdog on this. If it offers any additional security I'm gonna use it. May take it off the WEP and put on the other one some day when I have more time.

My router has had an upgrade available for a long time but I hate to download it. Fraid it will hose me.
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'02 Four Winns 234 Funship. 280 HP V-P DuoProp
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#431353 - 08/24/08 03:21 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
Silverbullet Offline
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Registered: 06/15/04
Posts: 4616
Loc: Reno, NV
Originally Posted By: Parrott_head
Well my MAC addy in my laptop somehow got changed. Checked it against the old config that I had saves when I set this up and it is different.

I went into my router and put the new addy in. Not sure if that is the best course of action or not.

My kids use this one a lot so I will quiz them about how this might have happened.


I didn't realize mac addresses could be changed. I use mac filtering to keep unauthorized people off the network. There are at least 6 wireless networks I can pick up at any one time.
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#431356 - 08/24/08 03:32 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
Admin Administrator Offline
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Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 2613
Loc: Cyberland
Quote:
If it offers any additional security I'm gonna use it.


Just my point.

MAC filtering, DHCP and "hiding" your SSID (for the record, you are not really hiding anything) are next to nothing for someone who wants to use your wireless and knows how.

Defeating such "security measures" are so easy as to not be worth the trouble to implement.

Why do anything else when all you have to do is turn on WPA?

To do the others is kind of like adding a twisty tie to a padlock.

No appreciable addition to your overall security. So why bother with it?

I could defeat your twisty tie in 15 mins, but would not even attempt to bust your padlock. wink

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#431364 - 08/24/08 04:16 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Silverbullet]
Parrott_head Offline
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Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
Originally Posted By: Silverbullet
Originally Posted By: Parrott_head
Well my MAC addy in my laptop somehow got changed. Checked it against the old config that I had saves when I set this up and it is different.

I went into my router and put the new addy in. Not sure if that is the best course of action or not.

My kids use this one a lot so I will quiz them about how this might have happened.


I didn't realize mac addresses could be changed. I use mac filtering to keep unauthorized people off the network. There are at least 6 wireless networks I can pick up at any one time.


We have several in my neighborhood as well. Most are locked up.
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'02 Four Winns 234 Funship. 280 HP V-P DuoProp
'05 F250 CrewCab 6.0 PowerStroke
'98 Neutered Male Siamese jacked up on catnip (will give to good home)
"Hey, if I'm a Vice Admiral, which vice do I get to claim?"

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#431391 - 08/24/08 08:29 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
Parrott_head Offline
Admiral of Vice
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Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
_________________________
'02 Four Winns 234 Funship. 280 HP V-P DuoProp
'05 F250 CrewCab 6.0 PowerStroke
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"Hey, if I'm a Vice Admiral, which vice do I get to claim?"

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#431411 - 08/25/08 04:44 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
Admin Administrator Offline
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Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 2613
Loc: Cyberland
I sure hope the author of that article is not getting paid to be a wireless security "geek".

He is only parroting the same junk that many others do who know next to nothing about it.

Some good comments at least. The bad ones are also good in as much as they provide the set-up for the good ones.

One of the best comments is this one... (of course I think so, this person is "parroting" my point nicely wink )

Quote:


kamikaze.cockroach Aug 20, 2008 at 6:47 am

When will people learn. #2-4 and Corey H’s suggestion are completely useless for security and here’s why.

If you don’t have WPA and a good long passphrase, any noob can download airsnort and:
1) Find your SSID, hidden or not.
2) Find the MAC addresses of all your wireless devices and spoof any one.
3) Find your gateway IP no matter what IP range you use.

Trust me, I’ve done this many times for penetration testing. #2-4 will only make it much harder for you to add new devices to your network they offer no security beyond WPA whatsoever. In fact, they add a false sense of security which is worse. As long as you have a good WPA passphrase it doesn’t matter if your neighbors know all the rest of the info, it’s useless.

To Corey, what you’re doing is not only not a good idea, it breaks IP routing. You can’t just choose a random address range. 192.168 etc. are used for a reason. Those are private IP ranges. If you choose a random IP range that happens to belong to Google, you won’t be able to access Google since your IP routing table won’t use the gateway for that range. Also, it’s trivial for someone to determine your gateway address if they’re already connected to your WiFi. Lastly, they don’t need to know YOUR DNS addresses, they can use ANY DNS address.

To those who say “I don’t care if someone uses my connection”, have you thought about this: They could be downloading MP3s, movies, porn etc. which can land you in jail and cost you tens of thousands in legal fees. They could also be seeding viruses, launching DDoS attacks or even capturing your emails and gathering information for a social engineering attack.
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#431427 - 08/25/08 07:15 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Admin]
Parrott_head Offline
Admiral of Vice
Admiral

Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
Well I'm going back through my settings and beefing things up. Will make it to where only on pc can access router.
Will do the WPA thing later. THe trouble with that is the key has a lifetime value for time it will remain active. I don't want to have to do a new key every 10 days or so. Cannot see a way to make the key last as long as I wish.
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'02 Four Winns 234 Funship. 280 HP V-P DuoProp
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'98 Neutered Male Siamese jacked up on catnip (will give to good home)
"Hey, if I'm a Vice Admiral, which vice do I get to claim?"

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#431468 - 08/25/08 09:24 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
Parrott_head Offline
Admiral of Vice
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Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
Hey,

If I totally hose this does anybody have a recommendation for a wireless router that has the best security features? Right now I'm using a Netgear product, it's been pretty reliable and easy to work on.
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'02 Four Winns 234 Funship. 280 HP V-P DuoProp
'05 F250 CrewCab 6.0 PowerStroke
'98 Neutered Male Siamese jacked up on catnip (will give to good home)
"Hey, if I'm a Vice Admiral, which vice do I get to claim?"

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#431502 - 08/25/08 11:23 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
athiker Offline
Admiral

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 2454
Loc: Lake Norman, NC
Again, just following along here...not an expert by any means...but I like Netgear as well. My Dad and I have both used the Netgear WPN802. He bought retail and I bought refurbed on eBay. My Dad is less computer savvy than me and had no problem getting set up. I bought from these guys. I bid on quite a few and paid less than $20 before shipping. Looks like they raised shipping...it was 9.95. They seem to have a constant supply of Buy It Now and regular auctions so one can be patient...mine did have the install CD...but some may not...all is available from Netgear website though. It works well in my house from lower left first floor to upper right 2nd floor with no problems. This is not the latest and greatest 802.11n standard however...it is compatible w/ b and g. Fast enough for general surfing IMO.

My only previous experience has been w/ D-Link. I have used both a "load-balancing" router to combine my DSL and Cable internet service and a wireless router. I found the interfaces more cumbersome and in the end both failed to deliver either by my error or the router's. From reading others' comments re: the load balancing router...I wasn't alone.

In general I've been told its better to use one company for all components of a network system if possible. Only one phone number to call (and wait on hold) and less likely to be told by support that its the other company's product at fault.

What Netgear router are you using now? "The best security features"...it sounds like the WPA passcode is pretty much all you can hang your hat on for a basic home setup no matter which router you use? idn I do remember after trying a few different setups messing around w/ a thumbdrive where you had to install a very long "key" on each computer w/ the D-Link router. I don't remember what security standard that was. It did work for a while, and seemed like one of the securest ways to go since the "key" was much more complex than a typical passcode, don't really know what happened to make it stop working, but it did. smile The D-Link model I had (DI-524) never had the range I needed anyway so I bought the Netgear.

Topic Drift: Admin or others know a moderate cost load-balancing router to recommend? I have the DI-LB604 which acts like it is balancing the load when looking at the router stats, but when one service is interrupted I still momentarily lose my internet service and my VPN is disconnected. I don't really need my load balanced I guess, but uninterrupted service in the event either DSL or cable service is disrupted.
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#431518 - 08/25/08 01:00 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: athiker]
Woody Offline
Vice Admiral

Registered: 07/26/03
Posts: 377
Loc: Cincinnati, OH
I have the same Netgear router as athiker. After watching the ads on Sunday, I got one earlier this year at a price pretty close to that after rebate. It was at Office Depot, I think.

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#431654 - 08/25/08 09:14 PM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Woody]
Parrott_head Offline
Admiral of Vice
Admiral

Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
Netgear WGN614 is the model I have. It does have WPA-PSK or whatever, I've just never set it up.

It does ok for our house. I'm in the garage with my daughter and both of us are surfing the net on laptops.

The cat is doing kitty wheelies...


Edited by Parrott_head (08/25/08 09:19 PM)
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'02 Four Winns 234 Funship. 280 HP V-P DuoProp
'05 F250 CrewCab 6.0 PowerStroke
'98 Neutered Male Siamese jacked up on catnip (will give to good home)
"Hey, if I'm a Vice Admiral, which vice do I get to claim?"

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#431993 - 08/27/08 10:16 AM Re: Lost wireless connection, MAC addy changed? [Re: Parrott_head]
Parrott_head Offline
Admiral of Vice
Admiral

Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 4278
Well I got all the settings set up pretty much. Did the WPA-SPK or whatever.

Will upgrade the router firmware in a couple of days after I'm certain this is stable.
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'02 Four Winns 234 Funship. 280 HP V-P DuoProp
'05 F250 CrewCab 6.0 PowerStroke
'98 Neutered Male Siamese jacked up on catnip (will give to good home)
"Hey, if I'm a Vice Admiral, which vice do I get to claim?"

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