Toyota has announced they are not going to resume production of the Tundra pickup at the Princeton Indiana factory - which is on temporary shutdown right now. They will move production to the Toyota Highlander and continue the Sequoia production. All Tundra production is consolidated to Texas.

This is a giant facility which was built to produce the entire volume of the Tundra in about 1999.

With the announcement by Nissan that they will buy their next generation Titan from Dodge and rebadge it, I guess the domestics are successful at fending off the Japanese in the big pickup market again.

I know that the TX plant was going to shut down for a while. Is it still shuttered?

The Tundra's are advertised in today's paper at a discount of $11,000 off of MSRP.

I guess the third time wasn't a charm...

Truly stunning news Indy. Thanks for the post.

Just bad timing, what bothers me even more, is that the Dodge Challenger just came back, to be followed by the Chevy Camaro. I'd hate to see them go away AGAIN, because of the gas situation. If I could I'd buy one of each, the modern era performance cars are nice but just don't do it for me. Toy will survive and once the economy slows down enough to drop gas prices, things will improve some, but not everyone going to the mall needs a 5000 lb pick up truck.

It really is the golden age of the performance car right now. The level of performance available from cars off the showroom floor right now is downright amazing. Hopefully it won't be followed by another automotive decade like the 1970s after the muscle car era ended.

What killed off the muscle cars was the oil shocks in the mid 70's.

Yeah, Toyota had terrible luck on the timing of the launch of their restyled Tundra. However, they still aren't coming even close to the sales of Ford and GM pickups, which they thought they might. (and which Nissan tried to aim for)

Problem is that a pickup is an image buy for very many of their buyers. If just one friend says something about it being anti-American, it kills the image.

I think Toyota and Nissan came into the market totally wrong. They thought that if they built a premium product (priced at a premium) that is competitive engineering-wise, then advertised the heck out of it, that it would sell. However the premium truck buyers are the hardest sell.

What I think they should have done is what they did for small trucks. Build a basic, strong, reliable, cheap, full-size pickup. Build their customer base among younger folks that need a long-lasting, cheap truck. Then grow with the customer base's economic influence.

Yeah, Tundra production shut down until November.

They did build 196,000 of them the first year, and are anticipated to build 140,000 this year - however, like housing they overbuilt.

They are piling up on the dealer lots and not moving very fast, so they are going to have to give a bunch of those away to move them - which will, of course kill production for next year, and resale on the ones they've already sold. It wouldn't be surprising to see less than 100,000 built next year.


http://www.courierpress.com/news/2008/jul/10/10web-toyota/

Thanks for the scoop!

Yeah, I noticed EXACTLY what you refer to the other day while "cruising" the local Toy dealer.

It seemed like 90% of the new Tundra's on the lot were "loaded" models. All the bells and whistles!

VERY FEW of the "work" or basic trucks to be found.


The new Sequoia is advertised today at $11K off MSRP.

Despite being an awesome vehicle, it's no secret why they aren't selling...

That's how a Chevy, Ford, or Dodge lot is as well. So that's no different. In the past, extended cab 4x4's is what everyone bought and they optioned them up like cars, not for work truck purposes. The difference with Toyota is that their equivelent truck is at least $5000 more thna a Chevy,Ford, Dodge, with MANY of their Tundras on the lot being over $40k. That's a lot of money for a half ton pickup.

You can get ANY Dodge quad cab on the lot for $16K off of MSRP.


Just as everyone jumped on the full-size truck band-wagon when fuel was cheap, they are now scrambling to get into something that is SENSIBLE for their needs, rather than what their ego WANTS.

Back in the 70's, you rarely saw pickups on the road unless they were being USED for something specific like hauling a camper, or towing a boat, construction, etc...

I still laugh when I see the moms dropping their kids off at school in a brand-new shiney 4X4 quad cab with the lift kit, tires and wheels. Heck, from the condition of them, they have never even SEEN a dirt road, let alone an off-road trail...

Dang - Why would ANYONE buy the Nissan that's just a re-hashed Dodge? Yuk. Bad move, Nissan.

The Tundra is an awsome truck and would be what I would look at for a full size PU. Just can't beat the Toyota quality. Love my 4Runner. Best vehicle I've owned.

Truck sales are down everywhere. As far s stripped down models are concerned, I think it's a combonation of what the buying public has trended to wnating and what the dealers buy in order to sell higher marked up vehicles so that their gross receipts and profits reflect the increased prices of the vehicles.

Billy nailed it.

What Toyota and Nissan BOTH missed is the size of the 'heavy duty' truck market. The 'truck guys' buy three quarter or one ton pickups with diesel power or a big block V8. Trying to sell them a high-output small block in a half-ton claiming to tow five tons? Losing proposition...

I disagree somewhat. I think there are many types of truck people, but three major categories:

1. Heavy users - need a dually to pull a big trailer with a bobcat, or horses, or grain wagon , or a really heavy payload to carry tools, feed, etc. Think Ford F250 or Super Duty.

2. Wannabe's - Need to look like they use a pickup - may occasionally haul something, but are worried about scratching the bed of the truck. Rarely go offroad. Want leather seats and DVD Nav systems. Hummer H2 and H3.

3. Economy users - Need a cheap, tough pickup, because they use it all the time. No special off-road capability needed, but it has to take abuse because it will get trashed. Chevy Work Truck, or Econoline van.

Those segments have blurred in recent years, because the buyers wanted and then the sellers built vehicles that cross the lines. Most of the buyers are in segments 2 and 3. Segment 1 is a fairly small group.

Toyota and Nissan both built real trucks targeted at segment 2. They skipped the cheap end and skipped the high end. But segment 2 buyers don't really want a real truck, they want something that looks like a real truck. So, you don't sell them with advertising targeted toward a contractor - don't tell them about towing, or the size of your brakes... However, with the gas price shock - this group disappeared!

Real contractors are in segment 1 and 3. They are the ones that need a truck today and are buying. In segment 1 you better have your diesel engine - but it's a really small market. In segment 3 you better have your hose-out interior and a low price - and big brakes and towing capacity.

Yeah, "ego" motivated purchases will only go so far...

When the stuff hits the fan, folks 'bottoms' pucker up and they get back to reality.

And that's where most of them should have stayed to begin with...

I'm not sure "wannabe" is an accurate way to describe that group (although I generally agree with the 3 groups). I own a truck but don't need to tow a bobcat around. I do tow a boat and want to be able to bring home the occasional sheet of plywood and whatnot. And yeah - I have a bedliner . Nothing wrong with taking care of a vehicle for the long term (11 years and counting).

I'd call that group "occasional/recreational."

I don't know about those three grouping. I am in 1 with a SuperDuty and 3 for diesel economy. As far as 2 goes, I occasionally haul something and tow the boat and put down a spray on bed liner so I don't worry about scratching the bed, take it off road from time to time and have some scars to show for it.

Call it what you want. Heck, I'm in that category too.

I'd say if you've got a Super Duty Diesel and you occasionally tow a boat, and it's got a bedliner then your a "super wannabe".

I have a spray on bed liner as plastic ones I don't care for. I put a tarp in the back when I load grass clippings or yard waste to take to the dump as it is quicker to pull on the tarp then to off load the stuff with a broom or shovel. I also have rubber floor mats with a lip to hold the water from melted snow or from launching the boat.

My truck is a 4 door that can be used as a truck, used as a mini-van (haul 6 people). I guess I fall under your classificatin #2.

I think that group three should be those who need a truck for personal needs, but want one that is family friendly. Put all the work trucks into group one. And there is blending issues. How would you category a truck that is owned by someone that works a regular job, but comes home and work evenings on the family farm? If all they use it for is farm related, that is group one, but most also use it as a commuter/family vehicle.

I was out on a wind farm thats still under construction earlier today. I was suprised at how many new Tundra's I saw out there. Had to of been 10 at least scattered at different turbine sites.

As I said, the lines blur a bit, and there are dozens of real categories for trucks, I was just trying to group them to show where Toyota and Nissan missed the mark.

Also, if it's a real farm truck, it ain't no family hauler - I grew up on a farm, and I know that one first hand...

We keep the Ford around for the occasional 'help someone move' or towing a boat around. Most of the time it just sits. It's a "small" 3/4 ton SC with only the V8 Triton, but I yanked around a 14,000# 5'er with it. Just fine. The thing is now 7 years old, but only has 35,000 miles on it so it's basically like new. There's absolutely NO reason to even consider buying another truck...

And even if I WERE considering another truck, I would never even bother looking at Toyota or Nissan. Why? Because I wouldn't look at a Chev or a Dodge either. Not a "chevy sucks" thing, I'm a little too old for that nonsense, it's just a plain and simple "I've had good luck with Fords" thing. Most loyal Chev and Dodge owners feel the same way...

And THAT'S why Toyota and Nissan can't sell big trucks...

I like you description of the three catagories, Indy. I have often said that 90% of the people with 4x4 extended cab full sized pickups should really be driving a Taurus/Impala/what ever Chrysler's car is/Camry/Accord.

Of course 63% of stats are just made up, and nearly 99% of mine are too!

i saw a new Sequoia the other day. Kinda makes you wish Expeditions were high theft vehicles. The local Nissan dealer is also dumping Armadas. They had an LE on the corner last week for $32.5k. Pretty good price.

BTW, am I in that 90%? I cannot see me behind the wheel of any of those cars.

Hey deep, thanks for paying attention and getting the Chrysler joke!

Grunt Grunt . . .

Gotta love labels I say drive whatever your heart desires and your pocketbook allows.

Nissan and Toyota screwed up in my opinion when they decided to take on the big three and produce full size luxury pickups.

My first brand new vehicle in life was a 1985 2wd, 4cyl,5 speed, single cab, vinyl seat pickup. Brand new was $5200.

I bet if they went back to producing basic, functional and reliable transportation, buyers would respond.