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#420137 - 07/08/08 04:14 AM
Re: Interesting thought on the true environmental cost
[Re: 230 Mike]
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Vice Admiral
Registered: 11/13/07
Posts: 244
Loc: huntingdon, pa
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#420188 - 07/08/08 08:08 AM
Re: Interesting thought on the true environmental cost
[Re: BillyB]
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Admiral
Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 2242
Loc: Indianapolis
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I've been saying this since the hybrids were started. Buy them for the technology - not the environment. They are environmentally negative.
The article is not exactly fair either. Comparing the entire cost of a Prius over 100,000 miles to a Hummer over 300,000 miles is stretching a bit. Recompute that to count the prius with 2 battery changes, and it will quickly fall over to the Prius' favor - by a large margin.
People also have the mistaken opinion (even my wife, who drives a hybrid Camry) that the electric motor creates the increased gas mileage. It doesn't. Generating power by running a gas engine, then turning a generator, then storing the generated electricity in a recharchable battery, then running an electric motor off the battery couldn't possibly be more efficient than simply running the gas engine in the first place. Every step in that process loses energy.
So why is the electric motor there? To supplement the tiny gas engine in the car with power. A little Secret - if you ripped out the electric generator, electric motor and the storage battery out of a Prius, it would still get 45 mpg - it would just be dog-slow. The only thing you would lose is the regenerative braking, and that would be offset by not carrying around all the extra crap.
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#420190 - 07/08/08 08:15 AM
Re: Interesting thought on the true environmental cost
[Re: BillyB]
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Bilge Rat
Admiral
Registered: 01/14/04
Posts: 10214
Loc: Massachusetts
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And I have a question: is that really accurate that the new EPA highway mileage is based on travelling at 80mph? Ummm, that speed is not legal in any state that I am aware of, so how can they use that test efficiency? It's like advocating breaking the law, just because you can. Doesn't seem right to me.
(I realize the old 55mph test was equally ridiculous too, though.) According to the EPA, I should get 28mpg on the highway, but I routinely get 32 without much effort, buat that seems to be max, actually achieved 32.2 a couple of times, but that's close enough to 32. It is a rating system with standardized parameters, not such accurate to real world though. I don't think they actually test each car either, isn't it just computed from vehicle weight and wind resistance along with available hp?
_________________________
"That's my boat..."
-Forest Gump
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#420192 - 07/08/08 08:22 AM
Re: Interesting thought on the true environmental cost
[Re: Indyboater]
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Bilge Rat
Admiral
Registered: 01/14/04
Posts: 10214
Loc: Massachusetts
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I've been saying this since the hybrids were started. Buy them for the technology - not the environment. They are environmentally negative.
The article is not exactly fair either. Comparing the entire cost of a Prius over 100,000 miles to a Hummer over 300,000 miles is stretching a bit. Recompute that to count the prius with 2 battery changes, and it will quickly fall over to the Prius' favor - by a large margin.
People also have the mistaken opinion (even my wife, who drives a hybrid Camry) that the electric motor creates the increased gas mileage. It doesn't. Generating power by running a gas engine, then turning a generator, then storing the generated electricity in a recharchable battery, then running an electric motor off the battery couldn't possibly be more efficient than simply running the gas engine in the first place. Every step in that process loses energy.
So why is the electric motor there? To supplement the tiny gas engine in the car with power. A little Secret - if you ripped out the electric generator, electric motor and the storage battery out of a Prius, it would still get 45 mpg - it would just be dog-slow. The only thing you would lose is the regenerative braking, and that would be offset by not carrying around all the extra crap.
How much does an extra battery cost to have installed? I forwarded the link to another guy here at work and we chatted briefly on it. Can a Prius survive 300,000 miles? and how much extra parts have to go into one over that mileage in comparison to the Hummer? Hummers are built pretty heavy, and the Prius isn't as much, but carries a lot of weight. Will that have an effect, especially on north east roads? I tend to think so. This article would have been better related to a bigger populace and put the Prius against something like a mid/full size sedan and a mid size SUV.
_________________________
"That's my boat..."
-Forest Gump
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Just follow the idiots like lemmings. 
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