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#402437 - 05/05/08 09:32 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: Jeffski]  
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trooplewis Offline
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trooplewis  Offline
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Tough call on this one, but whenever you resist arrest, whether you are right or wrong, you are asking for serious trouble that is going to get worse.

Add alcohol to the equation and you are not thinking as logically as usual, people do stupid things.

When you get inspected don't you get a certificate or something that you can wave around the next time to avoid another inspection? My CG inspection is good for a year, still have the certificate onboard.

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#402439 - 05/05/08 09:37 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: Jeffski]  
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Bowline Offline
Boatless in LV
Bowline  Offline
Boatless in LV
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Las Vegas, NV
As far as safety inspections are concerned I am for them, but would rather them be conducted by the CGA or, perhaps a WP station on the shore. The CGA, at the lake I frequent, has taken to setting up an "inspection station" where you can voluntarilyhave your boat inspected. They give you a sticker to put on your windshield that shows that you've passed for the season. The WP pretty much will leave you alone after that unless you're acting squirriley on the water. Even when the WP inspects you on the water they give you a sticker to put on your windshield that shows you've been inspected. Again, they pretty much leave you alone after that unless they have probable cause to pull you over on the water.

I am in Jeffski's camp as far as the WP indiscriminately stopping boaters are concerned. There should be probable cause for pulling someone over or boarding.


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#402514 - 05/05/08 12:34 PM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: Bowline]  
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FatDog Offline
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and i also question these safety inspections as they often do not appear to be random,
that is why i questioned whether having 15 good ol' big boys is going to always be enough to warrant a random safety inpection,

BUT, i think most of us would admit that the liberty of being able to drink as you drive our boats MAYBE comes with a cost, and that cost maybe is that we have to live with these searches.
I wouldn't have agreed with that 20 years ago, but the waterways are getting more populated these days.


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pugs, boxer, bulldog

"Let us cross over the river and sit under the shade of trees." ...... General Thomas 'Stonewall' Jackson
#402524 - 05/05/08 01:05 PM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: FatDog]  
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Frantically Relaxing Offline
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Frantically Relaxing  Offline
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He must not watch TMZ. If he did, he'd know you CAN be famous AND get arrested...

#402625 - 05/05/08 08:38 PM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: Jeffski]  
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That English Guy Offline
One day I'll be King!
That English Guy  Offline
One day I'll be King!
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Rochester, MN
Originally Posted By: Jeffski
I go to Lake Michigan 5-6 times per year and get stopped at least 3-4 times. I think it's too much.


Me too, that's verging on harassment.


Legal Alien livin' the American dream baby!

2005 Larson Senza 186, 5.0 V8
#402638 - 05/05/08 09:32 PM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: That English Guy]  
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Jeffski Offline
Wingman
Jeffski  Offline
Wingman
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Michigan
I know you're teasing me...I can hear it in your voice...but I'm serious, it is an inconvenience that I'd rather not deal with almost every time out.


2009 Four Winns SL 242
Searching for that "One Particular Harbor."
#402659 - 05/05/08 10:58 PM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: Jeffski]  
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GoFirstClass Offline
Retired Boating Bum
GoFirstClass  Offline
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Grand Poobah

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Pasco, WA
Jeffski, I'm as much of a "leave me the he11 alone" kinda guy as anyone, but on this topic I am glad the water cops have the right to do safety inspections. I have only been stopped one time and it was brief, non intrusive, and the cops were very polite.

I watch them stop boats all the time and usually the ones they stop have been advertising "stop me cause I'm stupid". They also tend to concentrate more on boats coming and going from the heavy party areas. I'm all for that.

As to this Benson deal, HE is the one who said he was not drunk, not the cops. In 15 years of arresting DUI's I never had one tell me he was too drunk to drive. They ALL were "not drunk" at the time.

As far as Benson "not being under arrest", he may not have been told at that point that he was under arrest, but the reality likely was that he may have been under what is called "constructive arrest". In other words, he was not free to leave.

If the cops were taking him on their boat to shore to do more field tests, they probably have a department rule that everyone on board must wear a PFD. No exceptions. If he was under constructive arrest and was not free to leave their boat at that point he HAD to put on the PFD to go to shore. It sounds like he started to resist at that point and things went quickly downhill.

Without being there, it's difficult to assess what really happened. It's a "he said-they said" kinda deal at this point.

The general rule still applies though....when in doubt do what the nice officer says.


"Beachcomber" 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge


Anchor's down......Bottoms Up!
#402674 - 05/06/08 12:57 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: GoFirstClass]  
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NoMoBoatN Offline
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NoMoBoatN  Offline
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DUI/sobriety checkpoints on a local road or highway is one thing, one of which I agree with..but if the local cops or the Highway Patrol started pulling auto drivers over for a 'safety inspection' randomly, how long do you think that would be allowed before people started screaming.. So why is it ok to randomly pull a boater over and board for an 'inspection'? The voluntary inspection given by CG Aux and other agencies should be standard procedure, NOT random inspections on the water by WP.. unless you're like GFC pointed out, "stop me cause I'm stupid"

just my .02


05 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4x4 'Limited Edition'



#402715 - 05/06/08 07:58 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: NoMoBoatN]  
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BillyB Offline
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BillyB  Offline
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Peoria, Illinois
Originally Posted By: Nu2BoatN
unless you're like GFC pointed out, "stop me cause I'm stupid"


That is called "probable cause" and I agree with stopping people then. But just stopping boats for "safety inspections" is wrong. And so close to an "unreasonable search and seizure" that it makes my skin crawl. mad


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#402719 - 05/06/08 08:17 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: BillyB]  
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LanierBoater Offline
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LanierBoater  Offline
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Georgia
Again,

How would you ensure that the water you and your family boat on is safe, and free from drunk boaters and boats that don't meet safety requirements?

Do you really think irresponsible boaters will volunteer their boats for inspection?
What about the guy who polishes off a 12 pack while fishing in a cove, then proceeds back across the lake for miles to his ramp? Just charge him with BWI after he kills a family of 4? Write him up for not having enough life vests after the 2 yr. old drowns?



-------------------------------
"Politicians never accuse you of 'greed' for wanting other people's money --- only for wanting to keep your own money."
#402736 - 05/06/08 09:18 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: LanierBoater]  
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BillyB Offline
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BillyB  Offline
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Peoria, Illinois
Execute him in public, with the warning to others that they get the same treatment?!


I'm just happy to be here!



#402741 - 05/06/08 09:39 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: BillyB]  
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LanierBoater Offline
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LanierBoater  Offline
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Georgia
rofl

thumb


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"Politicians never accuse you of 'greed' for wanting other people's money --- only for wanting to keep your own money."
#402746 - 05/06/08 09:48 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: LanierBoater]  
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NoMoBoatN Offline
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NoMoBoatN  Offline
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Riverside, So Cal
How can you ensure that the guy next to you on the freeway going 70-MPH isn't drunk, his tire isn't about to blow etc... Those types of restrictions are not put on autos, and IMHO, I don't think it should be done to boaters.
If someone is observed drinking a beer, or boating in an unsafe manner, by all means, stop and board the boat and get that arse off the water..
Don't board me just because you can!


05 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4x4 'Limited Edition'



#402750 - 05/06/08 09:53 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: LanierBoater]  
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Bowline Offline
Boatless in LV
Bowline  Offline
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Las Vegas, NV
Sorry, LB. The ends do not justify the means. One could extrapolate that logic into EVERY instance of polie "work", if allowed. What's to stop someone from useing the logic concerning the police coming into your house to make sure that no one is violating any laws, such as growing pot in the basement, making meth, etc., etc.? That's why there are laws preventing such actions. It's called unreasonable search.

I am all for keeping the idiots off of the lake, and I do believe that there is plenty of opportunity for those folks to either be reported to the WP or for the WP to see idiots themselves. Being stopped, indescriminately, is not, IMO the way to go about enforcing laws.

The fact that the WP in this case saw actions aboard his boat that gave them probable cause to stop him makes it O.K. The fact that he disagreed with the WP does not make it O.K. to act as he did.


2001 Cobalt 206, 280hp V/P DP - SOLD
2003 Toyota 4-Runner Ltd
#402761 - 05/06/08 10:17 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: LanierBoater]  
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cathanas Offline
Lieutenant
cathanas  Offline
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Austin, Texas
I get stopped at least once a season by LCRA patrol. On a slow day, I have watched them stop every boat that came by. It takes about 5 minutes and they check registration, life preservers and fire extinguishers. They view their job on inspections as safety awareness, not party poopers. If your fire extinguisher is not in the green zone or you are a life preserver short, they will issue a warning and ask you head back in and fix the problem. However, if you give them attitude, they will ticket, arrest or impound. A few years ago I took a LCRA boating safety class and they tell you that in the class. Everybody plays nice and all is fine, but if you argue, yell and curse the party is over. I am sure that if you are drunk, all bets are off. Lake Travis (where this incident took place) has a very bad rep for drunken drowning deaths. People die every year on this lake due to boating accidents (too much speed and too much alcohol). We have already had several deaths this year and the official summer boating season hasnít even started.


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#402778 - 05/06/08 10:48 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: NoMoBoatN]  
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BillyB Offline
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BillyB  Offline
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Peoria, Illinois
Huge +1 Nu2BoatN.

Probable cause is the key to all of this. Have probable cause to stop, then you enforce the laws that already exist.

I am not as in the minority on this one as I thought, perhaps??

(I also oppose DUI checkpoints. But support Marked Police cars sitting outside of bars, observing unsteady walking customers walking to their cars, starting them, and attempting to drive. Probable cause, light 'em up, test 'em! Of course it could be like that internet joke where the sober guy stumbles out and the drunks sneak out while he's being pulled over! grin)

Last edited by BillyB; 05/06/08 10:49 AM.

I'm just happy to be here!



#402780 - 05/06/08 10:50 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: cathanas]  
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D-Rod Offline
Rock Chalk Jayhawk
D-Rod  Offline
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Back Stateside
I have yet to be stopped by Lake Patrol while captain of a vessel.

The last time I was on a boat that was stopped, I must have been 12 or 13 years old.

I had not given the stoppage subject thought until now.

I read a report that indicated CB's incident was not as drastic as the media described.


-YOLO
#402804 - 05/06/08 11:26 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: Jeffski]  
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Wet Doggg Offline
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Wet Doggg  Offline
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Rockford, Michigan
Originally Posted By: Jeffski
I know you're teasing me...I can hear it in your voice...but I'm serious, it is an inconvenience that I'd rather not deal with almost every time out.


Jeff...do you ever get the Coat Guard Aux inspection at the beginning of the year? If not, you get a sticker to put on your boat and the Coasties normally leave you alone then. With a new sticker each summer...I have only been boarded once and that is because I waved at the same guys three times I think. I was saying "thank you" and I bet they thought, "this guy is being too nice...he must have violations". I didn't and they were very nice the entire time.


2007 Tige 22i - Current
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#402805 - 05/06/08 11:28 AM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: D-Rod]  
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LanierBoater Offline
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LanierBoater  Offline
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Georgia
As some already know, I am an avid trout fisherman. 3 out of 5 times I go fishing, I am approached by a fish and game officer.
He usually chats for a while, then very politely asks to see my fishing license. I do not mind at all. I have really never thought about it. I don't know why. Same goes for the boat/safety stops.






-------------------------------
"Politicians never accuse you of 'greed' for wanting other people's money --- only for wanting to keep your own money."
#402829 - 05/06/08 12:07 PM Re: Bears RB intoxicated while boating. [Re: LanierBoater]  
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Indyboater Offline
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Indyboater  Offline
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Indianapolis
OK, I've got to comment here.

I don't mind getting stopped by the authorities for a check. In 10 years of boating, it's happened to me 3 times - all short stops, do you have life jackets? Have you been drinking? that type of thing.

But this guy was stopped 6 times in one summer of boating.

I'm betting it was racial profiling.

I'm also betting he played right into it - he's a really young african american guy on a big expensive boat, with probably a bunch of other young African Americans. They were probably playing loud music and partying - and I bet it wasn't Sinatra music.

This has drug dealer, or drug users written all over it, and they'll stand out like the sun in a clear sky.

After the cops get there and find out the guy has the money legitimately, then they can't just walk away - they have to find something wrong.

Either that, or they know who he is and just want to harrass the guy and get him off the lake - which wouldn't surprise me either.

If he was truly intoxicated and endangering the lives of his guests, or others on the lake, then he deserves to be hauled in, as does anybody in that condition - however, if the results of the tests are/were negative, I think he got a raw deal.

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