Your On-Line Port'o'Call
Page 4 of 5 < 1 2 3 4 5 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#402850 - 05/06/08 11:58 AM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: BillyB]
LanierBoater Offline
Admiral

Registered: 01/29/05
Posts: 2949
Loc: Georgia
Take a close look at the chart D-Rod posted. Most of the applications are for additions to existing plant sites.
_________________________
-------------------------------
"Politicians never accuse you of 'greed' for wanting other people's money --- only for wanting to keep your own money."

Top
Sponsered Ad
#402889 - 05/06/08 01:10 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: LanierBoater]
Bowline Offline
What's higher than
Admiral

Registered: 01/14/03
Posts: 4372
Loc: Kansas City, MO
I'd like to see Nuke plants constructed. There's no such thing as "clean coal"; that's an oxymoron if there ever was one. One of the ig concerns is what to do with the nuke waste. Nevada doesn't want it, but they're getting it shipped to Yucca Mtn.

_________________________
2001 Cobalt 206, 280hp V/P DP
2003 Toyota 4-Runner Ltd

Top
#402932 - 05/06/08 03:35 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: Bowline]
D-Rod Offline
Admiral

Registered: 06/25/05
Posts: 7542
Nuke Waste? Hum.

70 cubic feet of vitrified waste compared to tens of thousands of tons of dangerous crap?

I think it's a minor problem to solve. Funding is the biggest issue, IMHO.

Top
#402934 - 05/06/08 03:38 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: Bowline]
seadog Offline
Admiral

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 4013
Loc: Stillwater, OK
I hate to hear anyone say that there is no such thing as 'clean coal', 'safe nuclear energy', or the dozens of other things that get stated. Plasma gasification of coal is viable and can also be supplemented with trash and other waste products. This is an industry promo, but with every industry, you will find those who find fault, and those who are cheerleaders. My attitude is that we set the standards, and let the industry find the best means to comply.

Quote:
Retrofitting existing coal power plants with plasma gasification results in modernized clean energy facilities extending their life and eliminate the need to construct expensive new facilities. Westinghouse Plasma Corporation technology converts coal into syngas which can be burned in the existing boilers in a cleaner combustion process allowing old facilities to meet increasingly stringent regulatory and environmental standards.

“Coal has increased its leading position as the predominant Gasifier feedstock, now accounting for 55% of syngas capacity generated from all feedstocks, compared to 49% in 2004” – US Department of Energy, Gasification World Database 2007

Allows old facilities to meet current environmental standards through a 95% reduction in SO2 and Mercury, a 60% reduction in NOx
Allows biomass and other carbon neutral fuels to be mixed with coal to reduce CO2 emissions
Enhances power generation at on Brownfield sites in areas of high power demand
Makes it unnecessary to abandon older power plants, the people who operate them, the vendors who sell goods and services to them, and the communities who benefit from them
Is a more time and cost efficient solution than building new facilities
_________________________
03 Crestliner 2485 LSi 4.3 MPI
63 Newman 15'
01 Dakota Quad Cab 4.7L
08 Taurus


usa1

Top
#402942 - 05/06/08 03:53 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: seadog]
athiker Offline
Admiral

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 2456
Loc: Lake Norman, NC
Originally Posted By: seadog
I hate to hear anyone say that there is no such thing as 'clean coal', 'safe nuclear energy', or the dozens of other things that get stated. Plasma gasification of coal is viable and can also be supplemented with trash and other waste products. This is an industry promo, but with every industry, you will find those who find fault, and those who are cheerleaders. My attitude is that we set the standards, and let the industry find the best means to comply.

Quote:
Retrofitting existing coal power plants with plasma gasification results in modernized clean energy facilities extending their life and eliminate the need to construct expensive new facilities. Westinghouse Plasma Corporation technology converts coal into syngas which can be burned in the existing boilers in a cleaner combustion process allowing old facilities to meet increasingly stringent regulatory and environmental standards.

“Coal has increased its leading position as the predominant Gasifier feedstock, now accounting for 55% of syngas capacity generated from all feedstocks, compared to 49% in 2004” – US Department of Energy, Gasification World Database 2007

Allows old facilities to meet current environmental standards through a 95% reduction in SO2 and Mercury, a 60% reduction in NOx
Allows biomass and other carbon neutral fuels to be mixed with coal to reduce CO2 emissions
Enhances power generation at on Brownfield sites in areas of high power demand
Makes it unnecessary to abandon older power plants, the people who operate them, the vendors who sell goods and services to them, and the communities who benefit from them
Is a more time and cost efficient solution than building new facilities


There is the issue of "cleanly" getting coal out of the ground/mountain as well.
_________________________
2000 Cobalt 206 5.7L EFI Alpha 1 photo
1999 Isuzu Trooper LX

Top
#402943 - 05/06/08 03:56 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: seadog]
Bowline Offline
What's higher than
Admiral

Registered: 01/14/03
Posts: 4372
Loc: Kansas City, MO
But there are still things like arsenic that are by-products of burning coal. Are you saying that all of the pollutants that the coat plants genterate into the air can be eliminated? That there can be coal fired power plants that are as clean as nuke plants? Just asking because this is a subject that I know just enough to be dangerous discussing.
_________________________
2001 Cobalt 206, 280hp V/P DP
2003 Toyota 4-Runner Ltd

Top
#403316 - 05/07/08 04:37 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: Bowline]
D-Rod Offline
Admiral

Registered: 06/25/05
Posts: 7542
"France is currently playing host to the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor (ITER) at a site in Cadarache in southern France. The project, which is costing a whopping $12 billion, is a joint venture between the European Union, the United States, Russia, Japan, South Korea and China and India.

But the first commercial plant is still a long way off. Should everything go smoothly, ITER predict fusion-powered electricity will be available by 2045."

In two words.

We're Screwed.

Top
#403317 - 05/07/08 04:41 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: D-Rod]
D-Rod Offline
Admiral

Registered: 06/25/05
Posts: 7542
Advantages of fusion energy

First of all, fusion is an almost limitless fuel supply. The basic fuels are distributed widely around the globe. Deuterium is abundant and can be extracted easily from sea water. Lithium, from which tritium can be produced, is a readily available light metal in the Earth´s crust.

Fusion produces no greenhouse gas emissions. Fusion power plants will not generate gases such as carbon dioxide that cause global warming and climate change, nor other gases that have damaging effects on the environment.

Fusion is suitable for the large-scale electricity production required for the increasing energy needs of large cities. A single fusion power station could generate electricity for two million households.

Waste from fusion will not be a long-term burden on future generations. Only metal parts close to the fusion plasma will become radioactive. Any radioactive waste generated will be small in volume and the radioactivity will decay over several decades with the possibility of reuse after about 100 years.

No transport of radioactive materials is required in the day-to-day operation of a fusion power station, as the intermediate fuel tritium is produced and consumed within the power plant.

The fusion reaction is inherently safe. Only about two grams of fuel is present in the plasma vessel, enough for a few seconds of "burn". As fusion is not a chain reaction, the reaction can never run out of hand. Fission, on the other hand, requires control rods that prevent the U235 from reaching the all-important critical state -- it has to stay subcritical to prevent the explosion.

Top
#403327 - 05/07/08 05:12 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: D-Rod]
HotByte Offline
Admiral

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 7446
Loc: Barnesville, GA
News article about the expansion at Plant Vogtle near Savannah GA

Quote:


Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Georgia Power to pay $6.4B for new nuclear reactors

By KRISTI E. SWARTZ
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 05/07/08

Georgia Power will pay approximately $6.4 billion for its share of two proposed 1,100-megawatt nuclear reactors at the utility's Vogtle plant south of Augusta, the company said Wednesday.

The amount represents 45.7 percent of Georgia Power's ownership of Vogtle. The plant's other co-owners — Oglethorpe Power, Municipal Electric Authority of Georgia and Dalton Utilities — will also pay for their part of the project. The other co-owners' investment and the total price for the proposed reactors has not been disclosed yet.

The price comes with a number of caveats, according to Georgia Power's news release. They leave flexibility in the event of budget overruns and adjustments for change orders and finance bonuses.

If approved, the plants promise customers higher power bills when they come online in 2018 . Customers will pay an additional $12 a month on a typical 1,000 kilowatt-hour bill, the company said.

That amount is expected to decline over time, the company said.

"Demand for electricity continues to grow in the Southeast and Georgia," Mike Garrett, Georgia Power's president and chief executive officer said in the release. "While nuclear power plants cost more to build, they now have lower fuel and operating costs than fossil fuel plants."

Westinghouse would build the reactors. Its AP1000 design is new and has not been used before. Utility officials tout its simpler design and enhanced safety features.

Nuclear power is making a comeback in the United States as the nation tries to lessen its dependence on natural gas and foreign oil as well as cut back on carbon emissions and other pollutants. Based on the state's expected growth, Georgia Power says it needs to add more than 7,000 megawatts of capacity and that nuclear energy is essential to achieving that goal.

While several utilities have hinted at building nuclear reactors, few have actually committed to doing so.

Part of the issue is cost for utilities and consumers. The first generation of nuclear plants throughout the country was expensive to build. Construction cost overruns, combined with the Three Mile Island disaster, stunted the industry's growth in the United States.

What Georgia Power, as well as other utilities, will try to sell to consumers is that nuclear plants are actually cheaper in the long run. There are two main messages: The fuel is not as prone to wild price swings like natural gas. Secondly, it also does not produce carbon emissions and will not be subject to a future carbon tax, which will plague coal-fired and natural gas plants.

Utilities also have the public-relations challenge of convincing people that nuclear reactors are safe. Westinghouse's AP1000 reactors have three ways, instead of two, to pump water into the reactor to shut it down if a malfunction should occur. The model is also much simpler than previous ones because it has fewer moving parts, he said. Such designs are supposed to be safer, more efficient and easier to maintain.

Vogtle is already home to two reactors that began operating in the late 1980s. Besides Vogtle, Georgia Power operates the Hatch nuclear plant in southeastern Georgia near Baxley.

Georgia Power is owned by Atlanta-based Southern Co., which has the Farley nuclear plant in Alabama, too.

The additional units at Vogtle would require state and federal approval before they could be built.

Georgia Power's agreement with Westinghouse is the first of a three-step process. The second step involves an independent evaluator at the PSC to evaluate Georgia Power's project against bids from independent power producers, who may submit bids for plants powered by nuclear reactors, coal or natural gas to meet Georgia's future demand.

Find this article at:
http://www.ajc.com/business/content/busi...age_tab_newstab
_________________________

2002 Glastron GX205 & 2005 Pilgrim 276BHSS 5'er
2005 Chevy 2500HD LT Duramax TD & 1998 Dodge Durango SLT

Top
#403471 - 05/07/08 09:01 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: HotByte]
seadog Offline
Admiral

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 4013
Loc: Stillwater, OK
My parents worked at a coal producer in NE OK. It was a cleaner job than mining rocks in a quarry, or most construction sites. Most people have images of the deep coal mines, but a lot of the mining is strip mining. Properly regulated, these mining areas are restored into lakes and other uses.

As for arsenic in coal, why is that any different than arsenic in water, or dirt, or the soil that crops grow in? If it is an issue, then there needs to be controls to prevent the problem. I doubt that there is a problem that burning and scrubbing will not address.
_________________________
03 Crestliner 2485 LSi 4.3 MPI
63 Newman 15'
01 Dakota Quad Cab 4.7L
08 Taurus


usa1

Top
#403628 - 05/08/08 09:58 AM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: seadog]
Bowline Offline
What's higher than
Admiral

Registered: 01/14/03
Posts: 4372
Loc: Kansas City, MO
So, are you saying that in addition to any other sources of arsenic, that are inherent, that it should be O.K. to have it in the air that we breathe as well? Also, remember that a chief source of arsenic that makes its way into our drinking water comes from the fallout from coat powered plants. It is the chief source of arsenic in the lakes and rivers around here.
_________________________
2001 Cobalt 206, 280hp V/P DP
2003 Toyota 4-Runner Ltd

Top
#403666 - 05/08/08 11:33 AM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: D-Rod]
Frantically Relaxing Offline
Never get out of the boat
Admiral

Registered: 02/07/03
Posts: 6552
Originally Posted By: D-Rod
Nuke Waste? Hum.
...I think it's a minor problem to solve. Funding is the biggest issue, IMHO.

Ever hear of "Energy Solutions Arena"? Formerly the "Delta Center"? (where the Utah Jazz play)---

Know what Energy Solutions does? They dispose of toxic waste, including nuclear waste.

Know who wants Energy Solutions anywhere near their backyard?
NOBODY. Not you, not anybody. If YOU'RE not willing to have them set up shop in YOUR town, then by default you're not willing to "go nuclear".

BTW, Energy Solutions is IN my backyard, and I don't particularly care for it there...
_________________________
Yes, YOU are unique.
Just like everyone else.



. . . . . . . 1988 Skipperliner Custom 53x14 . . . . . . . . . .2007 Bayliner 175BR . . . .

Top
#403694 - 05/08/08 12:16 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: Frantically Relaxing]
MarkHB Offline
Dressed for dinner
Admiral

Registered: 09/12/03
Posts: 4932
Loc: CA
Quote:
BTW, Energy Solutions is IN my backyard, and I don't particularly care for it there...


Same problem with oil refineries, prisons etc. Everyone wants to build, but not in my backyard.

Mark
_________________________
24' Monterey Explorer
Honda PWC
http://www.picturetrail.com/markhb

Top
#403723 - 05/08/08 02:04 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: MarkHB]
D-Rod Offline
Admiral

Registered: 06/25/05
Posts: 7542
Not always true. In the State of Kansas, it is the locals of a community that WANT a big ugly coal burning plant to be built and it is the STATE that is blocking it.

Top
#403732 - 05/08/08 02:17 PM Re: Nuclear Energy is back [Re: D-Rod]
seadog Offline
Admiral

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 4013
Loc: Stillwater, OK
I never said that arsenic in the air is any more acceptable than arsenic in water. I said that if it can survive the burn, it should be contained by the scrubbers. Arsenic is a natural substance. All we can ever do is relocate it, or change the form it is in.
_________________________
03 Crestliner 2485 LSi 4.3 MPI
63 Newman 15'
01 Dakota Quad Cab 4.7L
08 Taurus


usa1

Top
Page 4 of 5 < 1 2 3 4 5 >


Moderator:  Admin, Finger Lakes Boater, Opus 
Google Search
 
Who's Online
4 registered (Dave R, Dock Holiday, John M, softsides), 7 Guests and 9 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
gwood, JUSTICEFURALL, brianford30, Doubles, bostonchris
4104 Registered Users
January
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2 3
4 5 6 7 8 9 10
11 12 13 14 15 16 17
18 19 20 21 22 23 24
25 26 27 28 29 30 31
New Topics
General Motors is cleaning out the attic
by MarkHB
38 minutes 26 seconds ago
London Boat Show
by MarkHB
Today at 05:33 PM
Damages?
by deepv
Today at 02:25 PM
Boat Leveler / Insta-Trim tabs?
by Nauti Dog
Today at 09:23 AM
Gas Prices this Spring & Summer ????
by tpenfield
Today at 04:25 AM
I hate it when this happens........
by GoFirstClass
Yesterday at 07:18 PM
Palm Pre
by etyppo
Yesterday at 05:44 PM
Interesting choice for an ad campaign name
by Rocnat4
Yesterday at 03:38 PM
apples new software
by rollofire
Yesterday at 10:33 AM
ENOUGH!!
by Andyk2
01/07/09 09:12 PM
Forum Stats
4104 Members
26 Forums
29921 Topics
448791 Posts

Max Online: 162 @ 04/30/07 11:57 AM